4 ms·

Embarrassed to say that my wife and I were duped into purchasing tickets to the show. We had thought it would be a highly choreographed, theatrical re-enactment

by chb 8y ago

Embarrassed to say that my wife and I were duped into purchasing tickets to the show. We had thought it would be a highly choreographed, theatrical re-enactment of significant events in pre-Mao China, and had not done any research on it. Instead, it was horribly amateurish propaganda (the entire "set" was a projected CG image). Heavy-handed plays for sympathy and the demonization of the Chinese state culminated in a spiritual Armageddon where a Christ-like deity leads his followers out of a world-consuming conflagration. The audience lapped it up (this was Arizona, by the way). There were no misgivings or complaints voiced as we shuffled out of the theater. We felt suckered, and, to this day, share knowing looks of sheepishness and incredulity when we see billboards around the country advertising the show.

chrisweekly 8y ago
Yeah I couldn't stand it either. For me the low point was a mediocre male tenor singing solo at the top of his lungs in his native Chinese, as the lyrics' English translation appeared on the screen behind him: "Denounce the heresy of evolution!" Total waste of time and $.
xkcd-sucks 8y ago
To be fair, Chinese propaganda comes off as heavy-handed to a Western audience, FG is putting on a propaganda show for literal survival, and FG has received the treatment which happens to "bad" groups of people. FG is a nutty cult, but (in my opinion) dont deserve to get organ harvested for belonging to a cult. Other "bad" groups might be Uyghurs now, Hui 5 years in the future, "intellectuals" fifty years ago, and lots more. The quote about "first they came for the Jews, and I was silent because I was not one" comes to mind.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- stickfigure 8y ago
  Did you read the article? The organ-harvesting thing appears to be disputed.
clairity 8y ago
interesting, i wasn't bothered by the propaganda at all. the fable they wove through the story was a bit simplistic but otherwise a fun diversion. the dancing was mostly good but not "the best". it wasn't all that different from modern chinese wuxia dramas: a little bit of rebelliousness underlying an uncomplicated morality tale.
tathougies 8y ago
Having grown up with many East Asians, I often times see people confuse East Asian aesthetics with looking 'amateur' to American eyes. I have not seen the show myself, but I wonder how much of this is going on. But, honestly, I'm surprised you were surprised by the political bent. I thought it was common knowledge that the Chinese government's suppression of traditional chinese art led to a diaspora. I guess having a Chinese piano teacher who fled for similar reasons changes your perspective.
- pthomas551 8y ago
  Shen Yun is run by Falun Gong, which is a Scientology-like cult. Their followers may be heavily oppressed in China, which is wrong, but it's still a cult. We're not talking about traditional performers who fled during the Cultural Revolution or something.
  - dionian 8y ago
    The CCP is 10x the cult that FLG could ever dream of being. Stop lapping up/repeating the antiFLG propaganda. Yes they have some weird philosophical beliefs, at least they are pro-love and anti-torture.
    - chillacy 8y ago
      But anti homosexual love, just to be clear. Here's the article's quote that I think sums it all up: > The fact that both Falun Gong and the Communist Party communicate via propaganda makes it almost impossible to understand what’s really happening
    - Kalium 8y ago
      Fortunately for us all, this isn't a contest. Both can be weird, crazy, and cult-y.
  - Frqy3 8y ago
    Their similarity to Scientology is quite striking. Complete with alien conspiracy theories [0]. [0] http://content.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2053761,00.html http://content.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2053761,00...
jjcc 8y ago
It's quite interesting that there's a big gap between English only readers and those have access Chinese(meaning language,not nation) media. FLG and the behavior of the group is well known among Chinese. The are the last one of the three groups called "独运轮" which effectively cultivated many CPP supporters among oversea Chinese community who are otherwise neutral or don't care much about politics. FLG make many Chinese upset by insulting their intelligence with foolish lies. Your experience shows almost same thing other than you don't know many facts inside China like most English reader in HN who get most misinformation on Western media. There's a conspiracy theory that FLG is a very smart way of CPP to get more supporters.i.e. it's a tool of CPP. Personally I don't believe it. It's different from so called "controlled opposition". "controlled opposition" is only helpful for keeping balance but can not create support. Edit:for typo
- doitLP 8y ago
  > you don't know many facts inside China like most English reader in HN who get most misinformation on Western media What are specific things you feel most Westerners are clearly misinformed about China?
  - smallnamespace 8y ago
    Maybe not straight up misinformed, but from my experience, many Westerns know very little about China's history and how it affects their outlook and actions. One reason Chinese rulers crack down hard on religious cults because they have a history of sowing widespread chaos and death if not kept in check: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiping_Rebellion#Death_toll https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiping_Rebellion#Death_toll Led by a guy who claimed to be Jesus Christ's brother. 20-30 million is in the range of WW1 casualties. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19437920 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19437920 has some other examples
    - i_am_proteus 8y ago
      Because the communist government demands a monopoly on being able to kill 30+ million people. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Revolution#Death_toll https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Revolution#Death_toll

by chb 8y ago

chrisweekly 8y ago

Yeah I couldn't stand it either. For me the low point was a mediocre male tenor singing solo at the top of his lungs in his native Chinese, as the lyrics' English translation appeared on the screen behind him: "Denounce the heresy of evolution!" Total waste of time and $.

xkcd-sucks 8y ago

To be fair, Chinese propaganda comes off as heavy-handed to a Western audience, FG is putting on a propaganda show for literal survival, and FG has received the treatment which happens to "bad" groups of people. FG is a nutty cult, but (in my opinion) dont deserve to get organ harvested for belonging to a cult. Other "bad" groups might be Uyghurs now, Hui 5 years in the future, "intellectuals" fifty years ago, and lots more. The quote about "first they came for the Jews, and I was silent because I was not one" comes to mind.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
stickfigure 8y ago
Did you read the article? The organ-harvesting thing appears to be disputed.

clairity 8y ago

interesting, i wasn't bothered by the propaganda at all. the fable they wove through the story was a bit simplistic but otherwise a fun diversion. the dancing was mostly good but not "the best". it wasn't all that different from modern chinese wuxia dramas: a little bit of rebelliousness underlying an uncomplicated morality tale.

tathougies 8y ago

Having grown up with many East Asians, I often times see people confuse East Asian aesthetics with looking 'amateur' to American eyes. I have not seen the show myself, but I wonder how much of this is going on. But, honestly, I'm surprised you were surprised by the political bent. I thought it was common knowledge that the Chinese government's suppression of traditional chinese art led to a diaspora. I guess having a Chinese piano teacher who fled for similar reasons changes your perspective.

pthomas551 8y ago
Shen Yun is run by Falun Gong, which is a Scientology-like cult. Their followers may be heavily oppressed in China, which is wrong, but it's still a cult. We're not talking about traditional performers who fled during the Cultural Revolution or something.
- dionian 8y ago
  The CCP is 10x the cult that FLG could ever dream of being. Stop lapping up/repeating the antiFLG propaganda. Yes they have some weird philosophical beliefs, at least they are pro-love and anti-torture.
  - chillacy 8y ago
    But anti homosexual love, just to be clear. Here's the article's quote that I think sums it all up: > The fact that both Falun Gong and the Communist Party communicate via propaganda makes it almost impossible to understand what’s really happening
  - Kalium 8y ago
    Fortunately for us all, this isn't a contest. Both can be weird, crazy, and cult-y.
- Frqy3 8y ago
  Their similarity to Scientology is quite striking. Complete with alien conspiracy theories [0]. [0] http://content.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2053761,00.html http://content.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2053761,00...

jjcc 8y ago

It's quite interesting that there's a big gap between English only readers and those have access Chinese(meaning language,not nation) media. FLG and the behavior of the group is well known among Chinese. The are the last one of the three groups called "独运轮" which effectively cultivated many CPP supporters among oversea Chinese community who are otherwise neutral or don't care much about politics. FLG make many Chinese upset by insulting their intelligence with foolish lies. Your experience shows almost same thing other than you don't know many facts inside China like most English reader in HN who get most misinformation on Western media. There's a conspiracy theory that FLG is a very smart way of CPP to get more supporters.i.e. it's a tool of CPP. Personally I don't believe it. It's different from so called "controlled opposition". "controlled opposition" is only helpful for keeping balance but can not create support. Edit:for typo

doitLP 8y ago
> you don't know many facts inside China like most English reader in HN who get most misinformation on Western media What are specific things you feel most Westerners are clearly misinformed about China?
- smallnamespace 8y ago
  Maybe not straight up misinformed, but from my experience, many Westerns know very little about China's history and how it affects their outlook and actions. One reason Chinese rulers crack down hard on religious cults because they have a history of sowing widespread chaos and death if not kept in check: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiping_Rebellion#Death_toll https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiping_Rebellion#Death_toll Led by a guy who claimed to be Jesus Christ's brother. 20-30 million is in the range of WW1 casualties. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19437920 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19437920 has some other examples
  - i_am_proteus 8y ago
    Because the communist government demands a monopoly on being able to kill 30+ million people. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Revolution#Death_toll https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Revolution#Death_toll