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> Popularity of a framework or paradigm seems largely driven by marketing and memes. I think a whole lot of developers choose technologies because they are pop

by rapsey 8y ago

> Popularity of a framework or paradigm seems largely driven by marketing and memes. I think a whole lot of developers choose technologies because they are popular at the moment for two reasons: they lack the technical knowledge and experience or maybe just confidence and/or they avoid some responsibility this way (since everyone is doing it). Of course this is most acute in web development because it attracts younger developers. Also the words performance and scalability attracts developers like moth to a flame.

_hardwaregeek 8y ago
Young developers (as one myself), tend to be overly focused on what makes them attractive as a developer. Kinda like an overly insecure teenager. So they pounce on any framework or tech that makes them desirable to an employer. Rails isn't hot, so it won't get them a job so they won't learn it.
- Supernaut 8y ago
  That's flat out wrong. As a Rails developer, I have a weekly stream of recruiters trying to get my attention.
  - aedron 8y ago
    It's about perception. But the trend is what it is: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=ruby%20on%20rails https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=r...
    - tim333 8y ago
      If you look at the trend for 'rails' it's much more level and googling 'rails' three of the top four results are for the framework. It may be people no longer have to type 'ruby on...'.
  - go_prodev 8y ago
    I think a lot of developers focus on learning newer technology stacks because they are hot and tend to pay more. But less popular doesn't mean it's not in demand. I know 2 COBOL programmers who are being paid a ton of money because of critical banking systems running it and candidates are hard to find.
- soulnothing 8y ago
  I don't like ruby or rails. But I feel not liking it has really hurt my career. The amount of job requests I get for Ruby on rails or ruby is significantly higher than my typcial stack. Additionally a majority of the remote jobs I've seen have been Ruby as well. So despite it not being hip. It is still very much a requirement.
codetrotter 8y ago
Not going to defend choosing what’s popular just because it’s popular but the main argument for using something popular IMO is that most of the sorts of things you want to do is likely to have been done by someone else already and some of those other people will have written about their solution or made libraries etc that you can reuse. Whereas if not many people are using something then the amount of information you can find, even in the official docs, is likely to be lacking. So you can save a lot of time by using something even moderately popular compared to using something that few other people use. However, the caveat of course is that if you blindly choose something just because it’s popular, or in spite of your own skepticism towards it because you let the hype get to you, then it is very much possible that you end up using something that is unfit for what you are trying to do and which even though someone else has used it for the same purpose is going to lead you to implement something that has poor performance, is too inflexible and/or has other undesirable properties. But really, the proper way to choose frameworks and libraries is to look at the docs themselves and benchmarks and make your decision based on that. Not to lazily use popularity as a proxy for estimating suitability/ease of use.
- rgoulter 8y ago
  "popular tech is safe because someone will have done what you want to do" is phrased negatively in this excellent opinion piece: with a new technology/tool, you don't know what can go wrong. With boring technology, there's enough community experience around it. https://mcfunley.com/choose-boring-technology https://mcfunley.com/choose-boring-technology It also seems like 'boring = popular & old', 'hype = popular & new'.
- rapsey 8y ago
  > the main argument for using something popular IMO is that most of the sorts of things you want to do is likely to have been done by someone else already and some of those other people will have written about their solution or made libraries etc that you can reuse. Yes but this holds true for something older that was popular at some other time (like Rails) and is no longer as widely promoted. Those are way safer choices.

by rapsey 8y ago

_hardwaregeek 8y ago

Young developers (as one myself), tend to be overly focused on what makes them attractive as a developer. Kinda like an overly insecure teenager. So they pounce on any framework or tech that makes them desirable to an employer. Rails isn't hot, so it won't get them a job so they won't learn it.

Supernaut 8y ago
That's flat out wrong. As a Rails developer, I have a weekly stream of recruiters trying to get my attention.
- aedron 8y ago
  It's about perception. But the trend is what it is: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=ruby%20on%20rails https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=r...
  - tim333 8y ago
    If you look at the trend for 'rails' it's much more level and googling 'rails' three of the top four results are for the framework. It may be people no longer have to type 'ruby on...'.
- go_prodev 8y ago
  I think a lot of developers focus on learning newer technology stacks because they are hot and tend to pay more. But less popular doesn't mean it's not in demand. I know 2 COBOL programmers who are being paid a ton of money because of critical banking systems running it and candidates are hard to find.
soulnothing 8y ago
I don't like ruby or rails. But I feel not liking it has really hurt my career. The amount of job requests I get for Ruby on rails or ruby is significantly higher than my typcial stack. Additionally a majority of the remote jobs I've seen have been Ruby as well. So despite it not being hip. It is still very much a requirement.

codetrotter 8y ago

Not going to defend choosing what’s popular just because it’s popular but the main argument for using something popular IMO is that most of the sorts of things you want to do is likely to have been done by someone else already and some of those other people will have written about their solution or made libraries etc that you can reuse. Whereas if not many people are using something then the amount of information you can find, even in the official docs, is likely to be lacking. So you can save a lot of time by using something even moderately popular compared to using something that few other people use. However, the caveat of course is that if you blindly choose something just because it’s popular, or in spite of your own skepticism towards it because you let the hype get to you, then it is very much possible that you end up using something that is unfit for what you are trying to do and which even though someone else has used it for the same purpose is going to lead you to implement something that has poor performance, is too inflexible and/or has other undesirable properties. But really, the proper way to choose frameworks and libraries is to look at the docs themselves and benchmarks and make your decision based on that. Not to lazily use popularity as a proxy for estimating suitability/ease of use.

rgoulter 8y ago
"popular tech is safe because someone will have done what you want to do" is phrased negatively in this excellent opinion piece: with a new technology/tool, you don't know what can go wrong. With boring technology, there's enough community experience around it. https://mcfunley.com/choose-boring-technology https://mcfunley.com/choose-boring-technology It also seems like 'boring = popular & old', 'hype = popular & new'.
rapsey 8y ago
> the main argument for using something popular IMO is that most of the sorts of things you want to do is likely to have been done by someone else already and some of those other people will have written about their solution or made libraries etc that you can reuse. Yes but this holds true for something older that was popular at some other time (like Rails) and is no longer as widely promoted. Those are way safer choices.