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In real life this is a non-issue since all commercial buildings that have undergone any sort of renovation in the last 25 years have CO2 monitoring integrated i

In real life this is a non-issue since all commercial buildings that have undergone any sort of renovation in the last 25 years have CO2 monitoring integrated into their HVAC control system.

lvturner 8y ago
In which country and under which building standard? Because I can tell you, I’ve been in plenty of modern buildings all over the world where there was clearly not enough oxygen in several of the rooms.
- antisthenes 8y ago
  Minor nitpick, but not enough oxygen is not the same as too much CO2.
  - User23 8y ago
    Fun fact: humans can't detect low oxygen at all, which is why nitrogen gas asphyxiation is something that happens by accident.
  - kozak 8y ago
    "Not enough oxygen" is what laypeople usually say when they experience elevated concentration of CO2.
  - lvturner 8y ago
    Nitpick accepted :-)
  - caymanjim 8y ago
    That's not a minor nitpick. It's important to note the difference. If you double the amount of CO2 in a room, that's still not a lot of CO2, and if you displace oxygen to double it, you've still got tons of oxygen. Humans are hyper-sensitive to higher CO2 levels, even while still getting a lot of oxygen.
- chroem- 8y ago
  Certainly in any developed country, though I can't speak for the developing world. HVAC controls have been around basically for as long as we have been making large inhabited structures (nearly 100 years). I do this for my job in the US.
  - lvturner 8y ago
    Both in the UK and HK I’ve been in rooms where there is a clear lack of anything approximating clean and fresh air, be it faulty installation or poor adherence to code, I don’t know. Either way, at least on a personal level, increased awareness of the risks is not a non-issue :-)
ehnto 8y ago
Business happens in a wide range of buildings around the world. I think the research is pretty important still. It also depends on office layout, every floor could be completely unique and built by different people. Perhaps your skyscrapers HVAC takes it into account but the office you are in is laid out with an enclosed conference room. The vents are not enough and the HVAC isn't sensing per room just an average sensor somewhere so it doesn't compensate. The takeaway for me is just to keep it in mind, not cause a big fuss. I think that's a sane thing to do.
- chroem- 8y ago
  It's per-zone monitoring integrated into each wall-mounted space sensor. That communicates with the terminal unit supplying ventilation to each room on an individual basis. Your office building is actually a very large robot controlled by quite a bit of software.
  - awakeasleep 8y ago
    But isn't the building targeting 'under 1000ppm?' That is the standard, and it's well over the point at which these new studies are noticing mental decline. I work in a leed platinum building, and I've been testing the air with 2 different brands of CO2 monitors, and I see them stick to around 850 ppm once everyone is in for the day.
  - ehnto 8y ago
    I guess my point is that's just not true for every building. I've never worked in a building with fancy HVAC. So dismissing the issue as solved doesn't work for me. My last office was a skyscraper and it's AC was just domestic wall mounted conditioners. There was ventilation, but it was only in the central area. The office before that was a two floor building with the same thing, except no ventilation in the door and solid roofing. Ventilation came from wall vents to outside. The conference room got stuffy and we would have to leave the door open. In our offices we would just open the windows. The office before that was a three story narrow building with openable windows and domestic AC units again. All very professional commercial buildings, but definitely no fancy HVAC.
chewz 8y ago
You need to heat the air in winter and cool it in summer. Some office building operators simply minimize the air exchange to show saving to their superiors. Same goes for buses in my city in summer. Drivers get a bonus for savings on gas so the aircon is turned down to bare minimum and it is suffocating inside especially as bus gets crowded. And opening windows is prohibited. Electric trams on the other hand have aircon to the max so it is freezer temperatures. One of the reasons I bike.

In real life this is a non-issue since all commercial buildings that have undergone any sort of renovation in the last 25 years have CO2 monitoring integrated into their HVAC control system.

lvturner 8y ago

In which country and under which building standard? Because I can tell you, I’ve been in plenty of modern buildings all over the world where there was clearly not enough oxygen in several of the rooms.

antisthenes 8y ago
Minor nitpick, but not enough oxygen is not the same as too much CO2.
- User23 8y ago
  Fun fact: humans can't detect low oxygen at all, which is why nitrogen gas asphyxiation is something that happens by accident.
- kozak 8y ago
  "Not enough oxygen" is what laypeople usually say when they experience elevated concentration of CO2.
- lvturner 8y ago
  Nitpick accepted :-)
- caymanjim 8y ago
  That's not a minor nitpick. It's important to note the difference. If you double the amount of CO2 in a room, that's still not a lot of CO2, and if you displace oxygen to double it, you've still got tons of oxygen. Humans are hyper-sensitive to higher CO2 levels, even while still getting a lot of oxygen.
chroem- 8y ago
Certainly in any developed country, though I can't speak for the developing world. HVAC controls have been around basically for as long as we have been making large inhabited structures (nearly 100 years). I do this for my job in the US.
- lvturner 8y ago
  Both in the UK and HK I’ve been in rooms where there is a clear lack of anything approximating clean and fresh air, be it faulty installation or poor adherence to code, I don’t know. Either way, at least on a personal level, increased awareness of the risks is not a non-issue :-)

ehnto 8y ago

Business happens in a wide range of buildings around the world. I think the research is pretty important still. It also depends on office layout, every floor could be completely unique and built by different people. Perhaps your skyscrapers HVAC takes it into account but the office you are in is laid out with an enclosed conference room. The vents are not enough and the HVAC isn't sensing per room just an average sensor somewhere so it doesn't compensate. The takeaway for me is just to keep it in mind, not cause a big fuss. I think that's a sane thing to do.

chroem- 8y ago
It's per-zone monitoring integrated into each wall-mounted space sensor. That communicates with the terminal unit supplying ventilation to each room on an individual basis. Your office building is actually a very large robot controlled by quite a bit of software.
- awakeasleep 8y ago
  But isn't the building targeting 'under 1000ppm?' That is the standard, and it's well over the point at which these new studies are noticing mental decline. I work in a leed platinum building, and I've been testing the air with 2 different brands of CO2 monitors, and I see them stick to around 850 ppm once everyone is in for the day.
- ehnto 8y ago
  I guess my point is that's just not true for every building. I've never worked in a building with fancy HVAC. So dismissing the issue as solved doesn't work for me. My last office was a skyscraper and it's AC was just domestic wall mounted conditioners. There was ventilation, but it was only in the central area. The office before that was a two floor building with the same thing, except no ventilation in the door and solid roofing. Ventilation came from wall vents to outside. The conference room got stuffy and we would have to leave the door open. In our offices we would just open the windows. The office before that was a three story narrow building with openable windows and domestic AC units again. All very professional commercial buildings, but definitely no fancy HVAC.

chewz 8y ago

You need to heat the air in winter and cool it in summer. Some office building operators simply minimize the air exchange to show saving to their superiors. Same goes for buses in my city in summer. Drivers get a bonus for savings on gas so the aircon is turned down to bare minimum and it is suffocating inside especially as bus gets crowded. And opening windows is prohibited. Electric trams on the other hand have aircon to the max so it is freezer temperatures. One of the reasons I bike.