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Spotify is essentially a middleman. Apple is much more, they’re building the entire platform.

justinjlynn 8y ago
Spotify build distribution, recommendation infrastructure,and more. They are far more than a warehouse middleman which adds no additional value beyond providing a retail outlet.
- eridius 8y ago
  There’s a word for what you’re describing here: middleman.
  - B0btheBuilder 8y ago
    I'm struggling to see a distinctive difference between a middleman and a platform...
    - itsOnlyLinguist 8y ago
      Aye. Everything is connected. We are all one essentially
    - eridius 8y ago
      A car dealership is a middleman. A auto manufacturer is a platform. The car dealership sits between you and the manufacturer, making it easier for you to buy the car, but taking a cut. But you don't need the dealership in order to use your car. Spotify makes it easier for you to find music, but once you've found music, you don't need Spotify anymore (not a perfect analogy since you need to pay to purchase the music from a real store if you're ditching Spotify, but close enough). The auto manufacturer actually builds the car, supplies the replacement parts and manuals for repair, provides software updates for the car's computerized systems, manages any kind of in-car network GPS systems, etc. This is Apple. They develop the whole OS, including all the frameworks that developers actually use to build their apps (and the developer tools too, for that matter), they keep it updated, adding new features and fixing bugs. Apple provides ongoing value to both the user and the developer over the entire lifetime of the app.
  - justinjlynn 8y ago
    There's a word for what more you're contributing to the debate here: nothing.
bad_user 8y ago
I pay for Spotify due to their app. It runs on all the platforms I want it to run, including on Linux or on my Playstation, you can easily switch devices, picking up where you left off, you can remotely control devices, etc. The suggestions engine isn't spectacular, but works. I also like to see what my friends listen to. They also have the best integrations with other apps. The music selection could use some improvement but it's much better than Apple's Music and getting better every month. In other words your claim is very disingenuous.
- eridius 8y ago
  You’re saying you get value out of Spotify’s services. That’s good. Middlemen exist because they’re providing some value. Doesn’t make them not middlemen though. Ultimately, if I use Spotify to discover an artist, I’m going to continue paying Spotify to listen to that artist and the artist themselves will be lucky to even make pennies off of that. I could move off Spotify and keep listening to that artist pretty easily, I just probably won’t. Spotify is a middleman focused on discovery but isn’t providing ongoing value to the artist once the viewer has discovered them. Apple on the other hand is building and maintaining the platform that app creators use. This is a lot more tha discovery, the app wouldn’t even exist without the platform, and Apple keeps adding more value to the platform over time. Apple is not a middleman.
  - bad_user 8y ago
    Spotify would and does exist on all the other platforms, like Android, Windows or the open web. Apple created a lot of value with its first iPhone, but the world evolved since then. And yes, in your definition, Apple too is a middleman, because a big reason for why many people buy overpriced smartphones is to use apps. That you can't move those purchases easily to another platform, that's the lock-in effect of Apple's walled garden, but that doesn't make them any less of a middleman. Speaking of pennies, I emphasize, but how much are artists getting paid by Apple Music? Isn't this hypocrisy on their part? This whole thing is infuriating because Apple can easily undercut its competition because they don't have to pay the 30% store tax. This is anti-competitive behavior and yes, I realize that Apple does not have a monopoly, but I think anti-trust laws should be rewritten, because this kind of behavior isn't acceptable coming from the world's richest software company, due to the infinite potential they have for harming the market.
computerex 8y ago
What an incredibly silly comment. Serving music to millions of people across all major platforms whilst also being kosher/legal are real multifaceted challenges. This is one of the reason why you don't see much competition in this space. Remember Grooveshark? That was closer to a "middle man" than Spotify, and they promptly got sued and got shutdown.

Spotify build distribution, recommendation infrastructure,and more. They are far more than a warehouse middleman which adds no additional value beyond providing a retail outlet.

eridius 8y ago
There’s a word for what you’re describing here: middleman.
- B0btheBuilder 8y ago
  I'm struggling to see a distinctive difference between a middleman and a platform...
  - itsOnlyLinguist 8y ago
    Aye. Everything is connected. We are all one essentially
  - eridius 8y ago
    A car dealership is a middleman. A auto manufacturer is a platform. The car dealership sits between you and the manufacturer, making it easier for you to buy the car, but taking a cut. But you don't need the dealership in order to use your car. Spotify makes it easier for you to find music, but once you've found music, you don't need Spotify anymore (not a perfect analogy since you need to pay to purchase the music from a real store if you're ditching Spotify, but close enough). The auto manufacturer actually builds the car, supplies the replacement parts and manuals for repair, provides software updates for the car's computerized systems, manages any kind of in-car network GPS systems, etc. This is Apple. They develop the whole OS, including all the frameworks that developers actually use to build their apps (and the developer tools too, for that matter), they keep it updated, adding new features and fixing bugs. Apple provides ongoing value to both the user and the developer over the entire lifetime of the app.
- justinjlynn 8y ago
  There's a word for what more you're contributing to the debate here: nothing.

bad_user 8y ago

I pay for Spotify due to their app. It runs on all the platforms I want it to run, including on Linux or on my Playstation, you can easily switch devices, picking up where you left off, you can remotely control devices, etc. The suggestions engine isn't spectacular, but works. I also like to see what my friends listen to. They also have the best integrations with other apps. The music selection could use some improvement but it's much better than Apple's Music and getting better every month. In other words your claim is very disingenuous.

eridius 8y ago
You’re saying you get value out of Spotify’s services. That’s good. Middlemen exist because they’re providing some value. Doesn’t make them not middlemen though. Ultimately, if I use Spotify to discover an artist, I’m going to continue paying Spotify to listen to that artist and the artist themselves will be lucky to even make pennies off of that. I could move off Spotify and keep listening to that artist pretty easily, I just probably won’t. Spotify is a middleman focused on discovery but isn’t providing ongoing value to the artist once the viewer has discovered them. Apple on the other hand is building and maintaining the platform that app creators use. This is a lot more tha discovery, the app wouldn’t even exist without the platform, and Apple keeps adding more value to the platform over time. Apple is not a middleman.
- bad_user 8y ago
  Spotify would and does exist on all the other platforms, like Android, Windows or the open web. Apple created a lot of value with its first iPhone, but the world evolved since then. And yes, in your definition, Apple too is a middleman, because a big reason for why many people buy overpriced smartphones is to use apps. That you can't move those purchases easily to another platform, that's the lock-in effect of Apple's walled garden, but that doesn't make them any less of a middleman. Speaking of pennies, I emphasize, but how much are artists getting paid by Apple Music? Isn't this hypocrisy on their part? This whole thing is infuriating because Apple can easily undercut its competition because they don't have to pay the 30% store tax. This is anti-competitive behavior and yes, I realize that Apple does not have a monopoly, but I think anti-trust laws should be rewritten, because this kind of behavior isn't acceptable coming from the world's richest software company, due to the infinite potential they have for harming the market.

computerex 8y ago

What an incredibly silly comment. Serving music to millions of people across all major platforms whilst also being kosher/legal are real multifaceted challenges. This is one of the reason why you don't see much competition in this space. Remember Grooveshark? That was closer to a "middle man" than Spotify, and they promptly got sued and got shutdown.