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Sure it exists, but it's not an infestation. Even then I'm not aware of it or telemetry enabled apps in any trusted sources like the debian repositories (if you

by flukus 8y ago

Sure it exists, but it's not an infestation. Even then I'm not aware of it or telemetry enabled apps in any trusted sources like the debian repositories (if you're aware of any please let me know), they'll even disable it from organisations like Mozilla that don't care about privacy. The play store cannot reasonably be considered a trusted source. If your going to download stuff from random places, which is how most telemetry enabled apps end up on linux systems then no sandboxing will work anyway, it will simply be disabled as part of the installation process. It's not a technological problem, you can't fix it with technology.

skybrian 8y ago
Yes, a Linux distro like Debian has some security advantages since they won't ship just any app. But relying on code review isn't the same as having sandboxing in the OS.
- flukus 8y ago
  There's two successful systems I know of out in the real world, Linux distros that rely on code review and iOS that relies on code review and sand boxing. There's two failures, android that relies purely on sandboxing and windows, which was too gimped by sandboxing to take off. > But relying on code review It's not just code review, it's having a degree of seperation between the developer and the packager/authorizer.
  - skybrian 8y ago
    Some things are more successful than others, but it's not a one-bit distinction. Arguing over whether to set the "success" bit would be silly. But it seems arbitrary to say that Android is a failure when it has more users than iOS or Linux. Browsers are another important example of sandboxing.
    - flukus 8y ago
      > But it seems arbitrary to say that Android is a failure when it has more users than iOS or Linux. I'm not saying android is a failure, I'm saying it's sandboxing has not prevented malware and spyware being ubiquitous. This was a problem way back before android itself was a huge success. > Browsers are another important example of sandboxing. This has been pretty effective at preventing malware, but the web is a privacy nightmare and constantly getting worse.
      - skybrian 8y ago
        Ok, I see what you mean. Caveats: Android doesn't rely solely on sandboxing. They also do automatic scanning and do often find stuff [1]. I also wouldn't say malware is so bad it's "ubiquitous" on Android since it's in the news quite often but I don't think the average user is likely to encounter it? My take on it is that current-generation sandboxes have permissions designed for security (preventing takeover by hackers), not privacy. In particular, preventing an app from phoning home isn't something they try to do. You can't have privacy without security so sandboxing is a prerequisite, though. [1] https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2019/02/how-we-fought-bad-apps-and-malicious.html https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2019/02/how-we-fou...
pjmlp 8y ago
Of course not, given the failure of the year of desktop GNU/Linux, there is hardly any money to be made.

by flukus 8y ago

skybrian 8y ago

Yes, a Linux distro like Debian has some security advantages since they won't ship just any app. But relying on code review isn't the same as having sandboxing in the OS.

flukus 8y ago
There's two successful systems I know of out in the real world, Linux distros that rely on code review and iOS that relies on code review and sand boxing. There's two failures, android that relies purely on sandboxing and windows, which was too gimped by sandboxing to take off. > But relying on code review It's not just code review, it's having a degree of seperation between the developer and the packager/authorizer.
- skybrian 8y ago
  Some things are more successful than others, but it's not a one-bit distinction. Arguing over whether to set the "success" bit would be silly. But it seems arbitrary to say that Android is a failure when it has more users than iOS or Linux. Browsers are another important example of sandboxing.
  - flukus 8y ago
    > But it seems arbitrary to say that Android is a failure when it has more users than iOS or Linux. I'm not saying android is a failure, I'm saying it's sandboxing has not prevented malware and spyware being ubiquitous. This was a problem way back before android itself was a huge success. > Browsers are another important example of sandboxing. This has been pretty effective at preventing malware, but the web is a privacy nightmare and constantly getting worse.
    - skybrian 8y ago
      Ok, I see what you mean. Caveats: Android doesn't rely solely on sandboxing. They also do automatic scanning and do often find stuff [1]. I also wouldn't say malware is so bad it's "ubiquitous" on Android since it's in the news quite often but I don't think the average user is likely to encounter it? My take on it is that current-generation sandboxes have permissions designed for security (preventing takeover by hackers), not privacy. In particular, preventing an app from phoning home isn't something they try to do. You can't have privacy without security so sandboxing is a prerequisite, though. [1] https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2019/02/how-we-fought-bad-apps-and-malicious.html https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2019/02/how-we-fou...

pjmlp 8y ago

Of course not, given the failure of the year of desktop GNU/Linux, there is hardly any money to be made.