5 ms·

A Smalltalk with multiple, separate images loaded at the same time.

igouy 8y ago
I suspect that I still don't understand what you're really asking. Do you imagine those "multiple, separate images" would run in the same OS process? Otherwise — [pdf] "Distributed Smalltalk" http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/main/documentation/VisualWorks/DSTAppDevGuide.pdf http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/main/documentation/VisualWork... Otherwise (for source code control) — "Mastering ENVY/Developer" https://books.google.com/books?id=ld6E19QIMo4C https://books.google.com/books?id=ld6E19QIMo4C
- protomyth 8y ago
  When I bring up Smalltalk, I get an all-in-one environment from the image I load. Its live and any code I add goes into that image. Now I can use code control and build specific images, but it pretty much is a one image at a time world. What I'm talking about is loading up multiple images into the same IDE and run them like fully separate images with maybe some plumbing for communication and code loading between them. You can sorta pull that stunt by, as stcredzero mentioned, running Smalltalk in Smalltalk, ut I want separate images.
  - igouy 8y ago
    > …loading up multiple images into the same IDE… At the same time? Why? What will that let you do?
    - protomyth 8y ago
      It would let me run a network of VMs with different code that could model my whole solution at once, locally.
      - igouy 8y ago
        > locally Meaning on a single machine. Not across networks. > run a network of VMs with different code What do you think prevents that being done with "fully separate images" (VMs in their own OS process) ?
        protomyth 8y ago
        The last time I played with a Smalltalk, all the code was one big image. There was no way to run multiple VMs.
        igouy 8y ago
        > There was no way to run multiple VMs. In this example on Ubuntu "visual" is the name of the VM file, and there are 2 different image files with different code in them "visualnc64.im" and "quad.im". $ /opt/src/vw8.3pul/bin/visual /opt/src/vw8.3pul/image/visualnc64.im & [1] 8689 $ /opt/src/vw8.3pul/bin/visual /opt/src/vw8.3pul/image/quad.im & [2] 8690 That's created 2 separate OS processes, each OS process is running an instance of the Smalltalk VM, and each Smalltalk VM opened a different Smalltalk image containing different code. Do you see?
        protomyth 8y ago
        I’m not sure if we are talking past each other or you are ignoring the whole IDE thing. Yes, I can run multiple VMs on the same machine, but you are missing that I want to spin up these VMs in my Smalltalk IDE and not via some terminal launch script. I want my environment there for me to edit and debug code. I’m pretty sure you cannot do that in VisualWorks.
        igouy 8y ago
        > I want my environment there for me to edit and debug code Both of those instances of the Smalltalk VM, the one in OS process 8689 and the one in OS process 8690, are headfull — they both include the full Smalltalk IDE, they are both fully capable of editing and debugging code. (There's a very visible difference between the 2 Smalltalk IDEs that opened on my desktop: visualnc64.im is as-supplied by the vendor; quad.im has an additional binding for the X FreeType interface library, so the text looks quite different). (iirc Back-in-the-day when I had opened multiple Smalltalk images I'd set the UI Look&Feel of one to MS Windows, of another to Mac, of another to Unix: so I could see which windows belonged to which image.)
  - scroot 8y ago
    Check out Telepharo: https://github.com/pharo-ide/TelePharo https://github.com/pharo-ide/TelePharo
    - protomyth 8y ago
      Cool, but that looks like a remoting tool not a lot of VMs on my desktop.

I suspect that I still don't understand what you're really asking. Do you imagine those "multiple, separate images" would run in the same OS process? Otherwise — [pdf] "Distributed Smalltalk" http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/main/documentation/VisualWorks/DSTAppDevGuide.pdf http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/main/documentation/VisualWork... Otherwise (for source code control) — "Mastering ENVY/Developer" https://books.google.com/books?id=ld6E19QIMo4C https://books.google.com/books?id=ld6E19QIMo4C

protomyth 8y ago
When I bring up Smalltalk, I get an all-in-one environment from the image I load. Its live and any code I add goes into that image. Now I can use code control and build specific images, but it pretty much is a one image at a time world. What I'm talking about is loading up multiple images into the same IDE and run them like fully separate images with maybe some plumbing for communication and code loading between them. You can sorta pull that stunt by, as stcredzero mentioned, running Smalltalk in Smalltalk, ut I want separate images.
- igouy 8y ago
  > …loading up multiple images into the same IDE… At the same time? Why? What will that let you do?
  - protomyth 8y ago
    It would let me run a network of VMs with different code that could model my whole solution at once, locally.
    - igouy 8y ago
      > locally Meaning on a single machine. Not across networks. > run a network of VMs with different code What do you think prevents that being done with "fully separate images" (VMs in their own OS process) ?
      - protomyth 8y ago
        The last time I played with a Smalltalk, all the code was one big image. There was no way to run multiple VMs.
        igouy 8y ago
        > There was no way to run multiple VMs. In this example on Ubuntu "visual" is the name of the VM file, and there are 2 different image files with different code in them "visualnc64.im" and "quad.im". $ /opt/src/vw8.3pul/bin/visual /opt/src/vw8.3pul/image/visualnc64.im & [1] 8689 $ /opt/src/vw8.3pul/bin/visual /opt/src/vw8.3pul/image/quad.im & [2] 8690 That's created 2 separate OS processes, each OS process is running an instance of the Smalltalk VM, and each Smalltalk VM opened a different Smalltalk image containing different code. Do you see?
        protomyth 8y ago
        I’m not sure if we are talking past each other or you are ignoring the whole IDE thing. Yes, I can run multiple VMs on the same machine, but you are missing that I want to spin up these VMs in my Smalltalk IDE and not via some terminal launch script. I want my environment there for me to edit and debug code. I’m pretty sure you cannot do that in VisualWorks.
        igouy 8y ago
        > I want my environment there for me to edit and debug code Both of those instances of the Smalltalk VM, the one in OS process 8689 and the one in OS process 8690, are headfull — they both include the full Smalltalk IDE, they are both fully capable of editing and debugging code. (There's a very visible difference between the 2 Smalltalk IDEs that opened on my desktop: visualnc64.im is as-supplied by the vendor; quad.im has an additional binding for the X FreeType interface library, so the text looks quite different). (iirc Back-in-the-day when I had opened multiple Smalltalk images I'd set the UI Look&Feel of one to MS Windows, of another to Mac, of another to Unix: so I could see which windows belonged to which image.)
- scroot 8y ago
  Check out Telepharo: https://github.com/pharo-ide/TelePharo https://github.com/pharo-ide/TelePharo
  - protomyth 8y ago
    Cool, but that looks like a remoting tool not a lot of VMs on my desktop.