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Whenever Apple's 30% take on the App Store comes up, people on this website get all up in arms about it. Let me provide some perspective, which I think is sorel

Whenever Apple's 30% take on the App Store comes up, people on this website get all up in arms about it. Let me provide some perspective, which I think is sorely lacking: I sell physical goods on Amazon. They charge me 15% for this privilege. The only reason they don't charge more is because physical goods have lower margins than digital goods (my margins after it's all said and done are somewhere between 10-15%). And, you know what? I'm happy to pay Amazon their 15% because they're bringing me customers that I wouldn't have otherwise. Perhaps thinking about it like this is instructive: does Amazon have an obligation to let me sell on their platform simply because lots of consumers choose to buy stuff from Amazon? Does Amazon have an obligation to change their fee structure so that I can more easily compete with Amazon Basics branded products? Should Apple charge a smaller percentage to subscription services that can't afford to give up 30%? Probably. It would net Apple a percentage of something, rather than the 30% of $0 that they're getting now. And it would be a better experience for Apple's customers. But it is in no way unreasonable for Apple to expect to get paid for originating sales of software and subscriptions. And it is certainly not unreasonable for them to get paid significantly more than credit card processing fees.

WA 8y ago
Thing is, unless your app is already somewhat popular, Apple won’t do anything for you. Maybe you get more customers. But maybe an app like Spotify invested enough in marketing to reach new customers without Apple‘s health. The problem is that it’s really hard to measure how many customers Apple really brings and how many would find an app through other means.
- toasterlovin 8y ago
  Amazon is similar. Listing your products on there does not lead to sales. So, in addition to the 15% cut, I pay Amazon roughly 5-10% more to advertise my products as sponsored listings. But I can tell you that Amazon has resulted in way more sales than advertising on Goole and sending customers directly to our site. There is tremendous value to being on Amazon. Despite the constant declarations of Amazon having a counterfeit product epidemic, customers are comfortable buying on Amazon. They know that Amazon will have their back if we rip them off. As a result, there are lots of consumers who only buy certain classes of goods from Amazon. And it is Amazon, not me, who has cultivated that relationship. It makes sense that they charge me a significant amount to participate.
bhl 8y ago
You’re missing the point: Apple seems to be abusing its power as a platform to unfairly charge content based providers with 30% tax while not applying it to themself. On Amazon, it would be comparable to charging you 15% while not charging themselves the same on their Amazon Basic products.
- toasterlovin 8y ago
  Where do you think the 15% that they (hypothetically) charge themselves for Amazon Basic products would go? Somewhere other than to Amazon?
locust101 8y ago
The difference is that for a mobile app, it's either apple's way or highway(more like nothing). You can't very well be a significant app developer by ignoring iOS. And apple does not allow users to sideload your app on the store. So the amazon analogy is disingenuous at best. You can still operate a website or dozens of other ecommerce platforms to sell your goods. But without app store, there is no way for you to reach iOS users. iOs users are almost 50% of mobile users and contribute much higher percentage of revenue.
- toasterlovin 8y ago
  iOS users have a web browser, no?
LynxInLA 8y ago
The Amazon Basics point is interesting. They are able to capitalize on other's R&D and market research with almost no cost. If you want to sell a product, you have to do some amount of research to determine if it will be profitable. They are able to just look at selling statistics and launch their own version of popular, profitable to produce items. This feels like an abuse of their position as a marketplace platform, but it isn't that different from grocery stores creating white label/off brand products. Maybe it only becomes an issue when they promote their own items and bump original products down the search results. This is closer to the behavior that Spotify alleges Apple is doing.
leoh 8y ago
Amazon has an obligation to play fairly in the marketplace at large and they don't. They operate at a loss. They shouldn't have to let anyone on their platform. But they should also play fair. As it relates to Apple, the iPhone or Android are literally the only reasonable means of accessing online services on the go. They are a platform of a higher order than Amazon and should allow others to play in their sandbox. I don't know what the right number should be — probably it should be zero. 30% is insane.

WA 8y ago

Thing is, unless your app is already somewhat popular, Apple won’t do anything for you. Maybe you get more customers. But maybe an app like Spotify invested enough in marketing to reach new customers without Apple‘s health. The problem is that it’s really hard to measure how many customers Apple really brings and how many would find an app through other means.

toasterlovin 8y ago
Amazon is similar. Listing your products on there does not lead to sales. So, in addition to the 15% cut, I pay Amazon roughly 5-10% more to advertise my products as sponsored listings. But I can tell you that Amazon has resulted in way more sales than advertising on Goole and sending customers directly to our site. There is tremendous value to being on Amazon. Despite the constant declarations of Amazon having a counterfeit product epidemic, customers are comfortable buying on Amazon. They know that Amazon will have their back if we rip them off. As a result, there are lots of consumers who only buy certain classes of goods from Amazon. And it is Amazon, not me, who has cultivated that relationship. It makes sense that they charge me a significant amount to participate.

bhl 8y ago

You’re missing the point: Apple seems to be abusing its power as a platform to unfairly charge content based providers with 30% tax while not applying it to themself. On Amazon, it would be comparable to charging you 15% while not charging themselves the same on their Amazon Basic products.

toasterlovin 8y ago
Where do you think the 15% that they (hypothetically) charge themselves for Amazon Basic products would go? Somewhere other than to Amazon?

locust101 8y ago

The difference is that for a mobile app, it's either apple's way or highway(more like nothing). You can't very well be a significant app developer by ignoring iOS. And apple does not allow users to sideload your app on the store. So the amazon analogy is disingenuous at best. You can still operate a website or dozens of other ecommerce platforms to sell your goods. But without app store, there is no way for you to reach iOS users. iOs users are almost 50% of mobile users and contribute much higher percentage of revenue.

toasterlovin 8y ago
iOS users have a web browser, no?

LynxInLA 8y ago

The Amazon Basics point is interesting. They are able to capitalize on other's R&D and market research with almost no cost. If you want to sell a product, you have to do some amount of research to determine if it will be profitable. They are able to just look at selling statistics and launch their own version of popular, profitable to produce items. This feels like an abuse of their position as a marketplace platform, but it isn't that different from grocery stores creating white label/off brand products. Maybe it only becomes an issue when they promote their own items and bump original products down the search results. This is closer to the behavior that Spotify alleges Apple is doing.

leoh 8y ago

Amazon has an obligation to play fairly in the marketplace at large and they don't. They operate at a loss. They shouldn't have to let anyone on their platform. But they should also play fair. As it relates to Apple, the iPhone or Android are literally the only reasonable means of accessing online services on the go. They are a platform of a higher order than Amazon and should allow others to play in their sandbox. I don't know what the right number should be — probably it should be zero. 30% is insane.