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Uber's self-driving car killed a person because its driver was playing on his phone rather than doing his job.

umvi 8y ago
Uber's self-driving car killed a person because the victim was jaywalking on an unilluminated section of 4-lane highway at night and did not stop, look, or listen before crossing
- hnuser987654321 8y ago
  Said person was also high on meth and weed.
  - CompanionCuuube 8y ago
    People not on meth and weed jaywalk without stop, look, or listen before crossing. Or are you saying that this person normally does those things but the meth and weed inhibited them from doing that?
linuxftw 8y ago
We don't know much about this person, what they were told to expect, what they believed their responsibilities were, what kind of training they had, or whether the person was obviously unfit for the task (eg, they hired a young person with no/little work history, etc).
SilasX 8y ago
In a sense, I want to agree. That was a big no-no on her part. But ... for a project like this, it's the kind of thing they should have planned for and could have easily worked around. First of all, Uber's setup was to have one person do both the analytics monitoring and safety roles. That's ridiculous. The safety person needs to focus on that alone. Second, for any boring job, it's expected that people will tend to mentally check out, and you should design it so that a single checkout doesn't cascade to death. They could have had a periodic "press this button to prove you're paying attention", or limited the employee from bringing any device except a limited one with no distractions. So yeah, she shouldn't have been watching a movie, but Uber shouldn't have had better safeguards for the inevitable attention drift.
- ghaff 8y ago
  The (literal) victim blaming on this thread is absolutely astounding. [ADDED: I'm not talking about the driver although they were partially at fault. But the person who was killed.] Anyone with that attitude shouldn't be allowed anywhere near developing or operating a mission-critical system.
  - umvi 8y ago
    The victim is partially to blame for her own death in this case. I agree that victim blaming is _not_ useful when trying to figure out why a safety critical application failed and should not even be in the equation when developing, operating, or maintaining such safety-critical systems. But to simply answer the question "Who is to blame for her death?" the blame does _not_ rest 100% solely on Uber, nor the driver, nor the victim. All 3 failed to prevent the accident (and all 3 had the power and indeed responsibility to prevent it). People are responsible for their own risk management. If I take an unnecessary risk (like jaywalking at night on a freeway) and I get hit by a car (autonomous or not), that's partially on me.
    - ghaff 8y ago
      There were at least three parties who bore some responsibility for what happened. But some people come across as simply excusing Uber in this case. I expect that many of those same people wouldn't be so quick to excuse a human driver who hits a cyclist or pedestrian who isn't interacting with cars in the safest possible manner.
- aaomidi 8y ago
  Yep. My local YMCA requires lifeguards to switch every 15 minutes.
  - SilasX 8y ago
    Smirking at how YMCA has better safeguards for attention drift around pool safety than Uber does around road safety.

umvi 8y ago

Uber's self-driving car killed a person because the victim was jaywalking on an unilluminated section of 4-lane highway at night and did not stop, look, or listen before crossing

hnuser987654321 8y ago
Said person was also high on meth and weed.
- CompanionCuuube 8y ago
  People not on meth and weed jaywalk without stop, look, or listen before crossing. Or are you saying that this person normally does those things but the meth and weed inhibited them from doing that?

linuxftw 8y ago

We don't know much about this person, what they were told to expect, what they believed their responsibilities were, what kind of training they had, or whether the person was obviously unfit for the task (eg, they hired a young person with no/little work history, etc).

SilasX 8y ago

In a sense, I want to agree. That was a big no-no on her part. But ... for a project like this, it's the kind of thing they should have planned for and could have easily worked around. First of all, Uber's setup was to have one person do both the analytics monitoring and safety roles. That's ridiculous. The safety person needs to focus on that alone. Second, for any boring job, it's expected that people will tend to mentally check out, and you should design it so that a single checkout doesn't cascade to death. They could have had a periodic "press this button to prove you're paying attention", or limited the employee from bringing any device except a limited one with no distractions. So yeah, she shouldn't have been watching a movie, but Uber shouldn't have had better safeguards for the inevitable attention drift.

ghaff 8y ago
The (literal) victim blaming on this thread is absolutely astounding. [ADDED: I'm not talking about the driver although they were partially at fault. But the person who was killed.] Anyone with that attitude shouldn't be allowed anywhere near developing or operating a mission-critical system.
- umvi 8y ago
  The victim is partially to blame for her own death in this case. I agree that victim blaming is _not_ useful when trying to figure out why a safety critical application failed and should not even be in the equation when developing, operating, or maintaining such safety-critical systems. But to simply answer the question "Who is to blame for her death?" the blame does _not_ rest 100% solely on Uber, nor the driver, nor the victim. All 3 failed to prevent the accident (and all 3 had the power and indeed responsibility to prevent it). People are responsible for their own risk management. If I take an unnecessary risk (like jaywalking at night on a freeway) and I get hit by a car (autonomous or not), that's partially on me.
  - ghaff 8y ago
    There were at least three parties who bore some responsibility for what happened. But some people come across as simply excusing Uber in this case. I expect that many of those same people wouldn't be so quick to excuse a human driver who hits a cyclist or pedestrian who isn't interacting with cars in the safest possible manner.
aaomidi 8y ago
Yep. My local YMCA requires lifeguards to switch every 15 minutes.
- SilasX 8y ago
  Smirking at how YMCA has better safeguards for attention drift around pool safety than Uber does around road safety.