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Nor any European carriers, nor EASA. I also notice that Canada is not interested in grounding them at this junction. I'd imagine that US pressure is preventin

by Svip 8y ago

Nor any European carriers, nor EASA. I also notice that Canada is not interested in grounding them at this junction. I'd imagine that US pressure is preventing the Europeans and Canadians from grounding them. At least so far anyway.

stunt 8y ago
I don’t think that is true. Even if there is a pressure, most probably it is only about not going public about it. This accidents won’t harm Boeing reputation. The only thing that might hurt it is more accidents or even worse, putting pressure on Airlines to use it during investigation. So even if there is a pressure, it will be only about not going public with anything related to grounding 737Max. Anything else would be stupid.
- jpmoral 8y ago
  How can grounding not be made public?
- mastazi 8y ago
  How do you not go public about grounding it? Due to regulations you can't operate a scheduled flight without disclosing the aircraft type, so the moment you start operating with a different aircraft, everyone knows, even if the airline did not release an official statement.
  - stunt 8y ago
    Airlines can still do it without making a public announcement about it. For new schedules itbis easy, and for existing ones just an update on bookings or reschedule. It would take sometime for the news to go out and yet many wouldn’t consider it a grounding. That’s way better than public announcements that gets picked up by media.
    - Svip 8y ago
      How would it take some time for news to notice? In the wake of this latest crash, news media and amatuers alike are constantly paying attention to what airlines with the 737 MAX-8 are doing. If they notice that airlines are starting to reschedule their flight plan to use other aircraft than the 737 MAX-8, the news will be out instantaneously. Indeed, if they do it in secret (attempt to anyway), it will probably be a lot worse than a public statement. I just don't see how you can hide that major a change (I think flight plans are public anyway) without someone noticing immediately in this day and age.
  - dmurray 8y ago
    You'd also have to cancel a lot of flights. Airlines don't tend to have a huge reserve of airworthy planes sitting idle as substitutes in case their regular fleet gets grounded.
- zipzap324 8y ago
  >This accidents won’t harm Boeing reputation It's already harmed and they longer they wait to take action the worse it will get. Their stock price is plummeting as we speak.
salex89 8y ago
Maybe it's a confidence thing. Maybe small operators from these regions feel less supported/confident than their European or American counterparts. This might be a very pessimistic approach but I suppose a lot more phones go ringing when someone from Southwest or RyanAir calls and asks:"Yo, what's up with my planes?".
- Svip 8y ago
  That just makes it sound worse. Why should Norwegian get better support from Boeing than Comair? While I have no doubt that FAA or EASA would have reacted with more expediency had the crash occurred in their jurisdictions, it scares me to think that Boeing treats its customers differently, depending on whether they are Western or not.
  - diplocorp 8y ago
    I think the idea is that Borwegian buys a lot more planes from Boeing.
  - wholien 8y ago
    the treatment is probably proportional to how many planes they order. Im sure if ANA or Singapore Airlines have some issue with their 787s, Boeing would respond immediately. Has nothing to do with western but everything to do with money. See Lauda 004 for how Boeing treats a small Austrian airline. They only responded once the CEO (Niki Lauda) forced their hand by saying he would do a public stunt if they didn't respond.
    - salex89 8y ago
      Exactly. I didn't mean to imply that Boeing is discriminating based on the locality of an airline, but there is no denying that there is more money to be earned in places other than Indonesia or Ethiopia. That probably does reflect Boeing sells and airlines buy aircraft. This is just a strong hunch, I have no empirical evidence. Don't get me wrong, I don't believe Airbus is a charity in any way and their sales are different.
    - 8y ago
mastazi 8y ago
CASA (the Australian regulator) just did it https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019-03-12/boeing-737-max-8-suspended-operations-australia/10894426?pfmredir=sm https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019-03-12/boeing-737-max-8-s...
mhandley 8y ago
UK CAA just grounded 737 Max, and not permitting overflight either. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-47536502 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-47536502 "The UK Civil Aviation Authority has been closely monitoring the situation, however, as we do not currently have sufficient information from the flight data recorder we have, as a precautionary measure, issued instructions to stop any commercial passenger flights from any operator arriving, departing or overflying UK airspace"
- alexhutcheson 8y ago
  Banning overflight seems like a politically-motivated overreaction. Both incidents took place shortly after takeoff, and there's no current reason to believe the planes aren't safe at cruising altitude.
  - avar 8y ago
    Dublin airport in Ireland is about as far from UK territory as both of the 737 MAX's were from their respective airports when they crashed into the ground. It would be an unfortunate complication for the current discussion on a hard Brexit potentially happening within 3 weeks if the UK needed to work out what to do with an airplane strewn across that border on top of everything else.
rsynnott 8y ago
There are very few of these in Europe currently. The UK has just grounded them, though.
lb1lf 8y ago
Norwegian Airlines / DY just grounded their 737MAX, too. Presumably as UK airspace was just closed to them. Anyway - the ball is rolling; it is much easier being the [n]th airline/regulator to ground it than it is to jump first.

by Svip 8y ago

stunt 8y ago

I don’t think that is true. Even if there is a pressure, most probably it is only about not going public about it. This accidents won’t harm Boeing reputation. The only thing that might hurt it is more accidents or even worse, putting pressure on Airlines to use it during investigation. So even if there is a pressure, it will be only about not going public with anything related to grounding 737Max. Anything else would be stupid.

jpmoral 8y ago
How can grounding not be made public?
mastazi 8y ago
How do you not go public about grounding it? Due to regulations you can't operate a scheduled flight without disclosing the aircraft type, so the moment you start operating with a different aircraft, everyone knows, even if the airline did not release an official statement.
- stunt 8y ago
  Airlines can still do it without making a public announcement about it. For new schedules itbis easy, and for existing ones just an update on bookings or reschedule. It would take sometime for the news to go out and yet many wouldn’t consider it a grounding. That’s way better than public announcements that gets picked up by media.
  - Svip 8y ago
    How would it take some time for news to notice? In the wake of this latest crash, news media and amatuers alike are constantly paying attention to what airlines with the 737 MAX-8 are doing. If they notice that airlines are starting to reschedule their flight plan to use other aircraft than the 737 MAX-8, the news will be out instantaneously. Indeed, if they do it in secret (attempt to anyway), it will probably be a lot worse than a public statement. I just don't see how you can hide that major a change (I think flight plans are public anyway) without someone noticing immediately in this day and age.
- dmurray 8y ago
  You'd also have to cancel a lot of flights. Airlines don't tend to have a huge reserve of airworthy planes sitting idle as substitutes in case their regular fleet gets grounded.
zipzap324 8y ago
>This accidents won’t harm Boeing reputation It's already harmed and they longer they wait to take action the worse it will get. Their stock price is plummeting as we speak.

salex89 8y ago

Maybe it's a confidence thing. Maybe small operators from these regions feel less supported/confident than their European or American counterparts. This might be a very pessimistic approach but I suppose a lot more phones go ringing when someone from Southwest or RyanAir calls and asks:"Yo, what's up with my planes?".

Svip 8y ago
That just makes it sound worse. Why should Norwegian get better support from Boeing than Comair? While I have no doubt that FAA or EASA would have reacted with more expediency had the crash occurred in their jurisdictions, it scares me to think that Boeing treats its customers differently, depending on whether they are Western or not.
- diplocorp 8y ago
  I think the idea is that Borwegian buys a lot more planes from Boeing.
- wholien 8y ago
  the treatment is probably proportional to how many planes they order. Im sure if ANA or Singapore Airlines have some issue with their 787s, Boeing would respond immediately. Has nothing to do with western but everything to do with money. See Lauda 004 for how Boeing treats a small Austrian airline. They only responded once the CEO (Niki Lauda) forced their hand by saying he would do a public stunt if they didn't respond.
  - salex89 8y ago
    Exactly. I didn't mean to imply that Boeing is discriminating based on the locality of an airline, but there is no denying that there is more money to be earned in places other than Indonesia or Ethiopia. That probably does reflect Boeing sells and airlines buy aircraft. This is just a strong hunch, I have no empirical evidence. Don't get me wrong, I don't believe Airbus is a charity in any way and their sales are different.
  - 8y ago

mastazi 8y ago

CASA (the Australian regulator) just did it https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019-03-12/boeing-737-max-8-suspended-operations-australia/10894426?pfmredir=sm https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019-03-12/boeing-737-max-8-s...

mhandley 8y ago

UK CAA just grounded 737 Max, and not permitting overflight either. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-47536502 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-47536502 "The UK Civil Aviation Authority has been closely monitoring the situation, however, as we do not currently have sufficient information from the flight data recorder we have, as a precautionary measure, issued instructions to stop any commercial passenger flights from any operator arriving, departing or overflying UK airspace"

alexhutcheson 8y ago
Banning overflight seems like a politically-motivated overreaction. Both incidents took place shortly after takeoff, and there's no current reason to believe the planes aren't safe at cruising altitude.
- avar 8y ago
  Dublin airport in Ireland is about as far from UK territory as both of the 737 MAX's were from their respective airports when they crashed into the ground. It would be an unfortunate complication for the current discussion on a hard Brexit potentially happening within 3 weeks if the UK needed to work out what to do with an airplane strewn across that border on top of everything else.

rsynnott 8y ago

There are very few of these in Europe currently. The UK has just grounded them, though.

lb1lf 8y ago

Norwegian Airlines / DY just grounded their 737MAX, too. Presumably as UK airspace was just closed to them. Anyway - the ball is rolling; it is much easier being the [n]th airline/regulator to ground it than it is to jump first.