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This is a company in absolute turmoil. How can a company go from closing almost all their stores, to reversing that decision in a week. How was that initial de

This is a company in absolute turmoil. How can a company go from closing almost all their stores, to reversing that decision in a week. How was that initial decision made in the first place? Was it Elon Musk snapping his fingers like Thanos? And then to turn it around in less than week shows a complete misread of the situation. Whoever made that initial decision should be fired, including Elon Musk. I think Elon Musk has great vision, but he is in over his head with running and growing the company. He needs to hand the reins over to something who is better at this than he is. His behavior, including calling a person a pedophile, tweeting about going private, and fighting the SEC over Twitter shows a person who is mentally unfit to be a CEO. This last decision really cements it, and the company, employees and shareholders could truly suffer going forward if he continues as CEO.

zaroth 8y ago
Did you call for Jeff Bezos to be fired when Amazon did an about-face on HQ2? This is a company which has outperformed every possible expectation since the day Elon showed up, and part of that formula from the beginning has been the agility to about-face and react quickly to new data. Some people say we need Elon out and “adult supervision” is required. Or maybe, “adult supervision” is where a company dead set on making the impossible a reality goes to die. We don’t know what new data has come to light since their public announcement. The landlords threatened to sue to prevent Tesla from breaking their leases. Maybe the employees were planning some action? Maybe there was some groundswell of customer feedback on the new test drive model. Maybe the announcement is the best way to truly gauge public feedback on a course of action, and a company that can quickly gauge that reaction and alter course instead of plowing ahead against the data just because they already publically committed has a huge competitive advantage. Tesla is attempted to do something entirely novel and would be the first ever to succeed at it if they pull off this sales model. Fits and starts are to be expected and calling for heads to roll because of quick adjustments in strategy I think is exactly opposite from of reaction.
- deft 8y ago
  Instead of making fun of the commenter and replying as if you're talking to an absolute idiot, maybe comment on the content of what they have said.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - zaroth 8y ago
    Edited.
- jcranmer 8y ago
  > part of that formula from the beginning has been the agility to about-face and react quickly to new data. It's been just a week since the announcement. The only new data that could have come out in that time frame is data on the order of "you should have predicted this" (or explosive revelations that were being held for this sort of announcement, which we would have heard about already and have not). In other words, it means that the original plan was based on incomplete data, and it does not reflect well on the CEO, or whomever was in charge of the final decision, that they were making such a major decision in ignorance of details.
almost_usual 8y ago
On March 8th it was reported they wouldn't be able to exit many of their store leases. https://www.wsj.com/articles/landlords-to-tesla-youre-still-on-the-hook-for-your-store-leases-11552059041 https://www.wsj.com/articles/landlords-to-tesla-youre-still-...
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- g10r 8y ago
  Surely they understood this before the initial decision was announced. No way those leases were disappearing.
  - coderholic 8y ago
    I wonder if it was a clever negotiating tactic? Scare the landlords, then walk it back and get a great deal. Even if it was that, seems risky to want to do it knowing it's going to make you look more broadly.
    - g10r 8y ago
      Tesla occupancy doesn't mean much for most of these malls/shopping centers, to be honest. Apple/Nike/Target, sure. Tesla, no.
    - pretendscholar 8y ago
      They already signed the terms of the lease.
    - xkjkls 8y ago
      Their landlords are a large number of different entities each with their own areas and laws. This is not an effective way to negotiate with 100s of malls around the country.
    - gamblor956 8y ago
      Scare the landlords, then walk it back and get a great deal. This is how the conversation with the landlord would probably go: Tesla: We're going to close our store in your mall. Landlord: Good luck with that. Next month's rent is due in a week. Tesla: But we're closing our store... Landlord: You signed a multi-year lease without an early cancellation clause. I don't care if you're closing the store, you still owe me rent for the remainder of the lease. You can pay it as due or buy out your for X% of the aggregate remaining amount. [where X is some obscenely large percentage approaching 100% because the landlord has Tesla over a barrel and doesn't need to offer a discount].
burtonator 8y ago
> How can a company go from closing almost all their stores, to reversing that decision in a week. How was that initial decision made in the first place? ... and did he even think of the people working there? What about the MASSIVE investment they've made in that space? So you're an employee working at these locations and you're comfortable with your job security? I don't think so!
- __blockcipher__ 8y ago
  Elon has never cared about his employees. Not ever. Here's my take: He has committed himself to a goal that he views as essential to the survival of humanity. Thus in his zealousness, he will sacrifice anything, especially actual humans, to accomplish his "goal". There was a time when I believed in his goal, but I've long since seen that the road to hell is paved with good intentions. He's happy to let Tesla factory workers injure and overwork themselves without fair representation. He views working at Tesla as analogous to "being in the special forces" (translation: sacrifice your life without fair compensation, then get thrown away when it suits him). The inability of Tesla to remove Musk from power merely confirms the obvious fact that he stacked the board with yes-men. I have nothing but disgust for the army of Tesla fanboys who claim any valid criticism is really just FUD spread by shorts. [/rant]
  - r00fus 8y ago
    > Thus in his zealousness, he will sacrifice anything, especially actual humans, to accomplish his "goal". A bit hyperbolic, though the fact remains that he should consider strongly handing off the reins to a capable and trusted lieutenant (take a look at SpaceX - probably closer to his heart but run competently by Shotwell).
  - Robin_Message 8y ago
    I understand he made a possibly illegal tweet to show off to his girlfriend, about and whilst on drugs, to the detriment of his company and his interests in it. That doesn't exactly smack of "sacrifice anything" - although you could modify your theory to some kind of cult leader-type complex, willing to sacrifice anyone else to the cause whilst having a good time themselves and it might fit quite well.
martythemaniak 8y ago
Well, it's now approximately 11 years since the infamous "Tesla Death Watch" series of blogposts. 11 years of constant "turmoil", "cash flow problems", "near bankruptcy", "Musk needs to quit", etc, etc, etc. Through these 11 years, they've gone from shipping a few hundred cars/year to hundreds of thousands of cars per year which are whole generation ahead of anything any other car manufacturer has been able to put out. Have you considered that maybe they're actually on a roll and doing just fine and this is mostly just tiresome media noise?
- thisacctforreal 8y ago
  Would love links to 11 year articles out of curiosity.
  - leesec 8y ago
    https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2008/05/tesla-death-watch-tesla-hasnt-produced-any-real-cars-yet-broke-their-promise-on-starting-production-again-and-dont-plan-to-build-any-cars-for-another-year/ https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2008/05/tesla-death-watch-...
    - Theodores 8y ago
      That brings back memories. Haven't read anything there for a while. The TTAC death watch is here: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=thetruthaboutcars https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=thetruth... For comparison: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=tesla https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=tesla
- FireBeyond 8y ago
  Yes, there's a lot of media noise, tiresome or otherwise. BUT: 1) TESLA, not the media, were the ones they said they were closing ALL their retail stores, _a week ago_ - is this not newsworthy? and 2) TESLA, not the media, were the ones who said they're now NOT closing retail stores open, _a week later_ - is this also not newsworthy? If so, what makes them so trivial?
leesec 8y ago
If you want to just list only negative decisions made by Tesla or Musk and then call for Musk resignations that's fine. You could also list some of the positives from the company like having the best selling EV in the world or making the highest rated cars of all time. In which case it seems more like Musk is doing fine. Why so hysterical?
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
8bitsrule 8y ago
He needs to hand the reins over... His behavior ... shows a person who is mentally unfit to be a CEO. At least he isn't running a country.
RivieraKid 8y ago
DB gave them $500M so they can now pay wages and suppliers without closing the stores.
grizzles 8y ago
How? They changed their mind. No big deal. I'd say what it shows is a commitment to intellectualism above superficial factors like a prior company announcement. To do otherwise would be path dependence. So I see strength, not weakness. Hope they get their costs under control though. That's the key to everything in manufacturing.

zaroth 8y ago

Did you call for Jeff Bezos to be fired when Amazon did an about-face on HQ2? This is a company which has outperformed every possible expectation since the day Elon showed up, and part of that formula from the beginning has been the agility to about-face and react quickly to new data. Some people say we need Elon out and “adult supervision” is required. Or maybe, “adult supervision” is where a company dead set on making the impossible a reality goes to die. We don’t know what new data has come to light since their public announcement. The landlords threatened to sue to prevent Tesla from breaking their leases. Maybe the employees were planning some action? Maybe there was some groundswell of customer feedback on the new test drive model. Maybe the announcement is the best way to truly gauge public feedback on a course of action, and a company that can quickly gauge that reaction and alter course instead of plowing ahead against the data just because they already publically committed has a huge competitive advantage. Tesla is attempted to do something entirely novel and would be the first ever to succeed at it if they pull off this sales model. Fits and starts are to be expected and calling for heads to roll because of quick adjustments in strategy I think is exactly opposite from of reaction.

deft 8y ago
Instead of making fun of the commenter and replying as if you're talking to an absolute idiot, maybe comment on the content of what they have said.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- zaroth 8y ago
  Edited.
jcranmer 8y ago
> part of that formula from the beginning has been the agility to about-face and react quickly to new data. It's been just a week since the announcement. The only new data that could have come out in that time frame is data on the order of "you should have predicted this" (or explosive revelations that were being held for this sort of announcement, which we would have heard about already and have not). In other words, it means that the original plan was based on incomplete data, and it does not reflect well on the CEO, or whomever was in charge of the final decision, that they were making such a major decision in ignorance of details.

almost_usual 8y ago

On March 8th it was reported they wouldn't be able to exit many of their store leases. https://www.wsj.com/articles/landlords-to-tesla-youre-still-on-the-hook-for-your-store-leases-11552059041 https://www.wsj.com/articles/landlords-to-tesla-youre-still-...

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
g10r 8y ago
Surely they understood this before the initial decision was announced. No way those leases were disappearing.
- coderholic 8y ago
  I wonder if it was a clever negotiating tactic? Scare the landlords, then walk it back and get a great deal. Even if it was that, seems risky to want to do it knowing it's going to make you look more broadly.
  - g10r 8y ago
    Tesla occupancy doesn't mean much for most of these malls/shopping centers, to be honest. Apple/Nike/Target, sure. Tesla, no.
  - pretendscholar 8y ago
    They already signed the terms of the lease.
  - xkjkls 8y ago
    Their landlords are a large number of different entities each with their own areas and laws. This is not an effective way to negotiate with 100s of malls around the country.
  - gamblor956 8y ago
    Scare the landlords, then walk it back and get a great deal. This is how the conversation with the landlord would probably go: Tesla: We're going to close our store in your mall. Landlord: Good luck with that. Next month's rent is due in a week. Tesla: But we're closing our store... Landlord: You signed a multi-year lease without an early cancellation clause. I don't care if you're closing the store, you still owe me rent for the remainder of the lease. You can pay it as due or buy out your for X% of the aggregate remaining amount. [where X is some obscenely large percentage approaching 100% because the landlord has Tesla over a barrel and doesn't need to offer a discount].

burtonator 8y ago

> How can a company go from closing almost all their stores, to reversing that decision in a week. How was that initial decision made in the first place? ... and did he even think of the people working there? What about the MASSIVE investment they've made in that space? So you're an employee working at these locations and you're comfortable with your job security? I don't think so!

__blockcipher__ 8y ago
Elon has never cared about his employees. Not ever. Here's my take: He has committed himself to a goal that he views as essential to the survival of humanity. Thus in his zealousness, he will sacrifice anything, especially actual humans, to accomplish his "goal". There was a time when I believed in his goal, but I've long since seen that the road to hell is paved with good intentions. He's happy to let Tesla factory workers injure and overwork themselves without fair representation. He views working at Tesla as analogous to "being in the special forces" (translation: sacrifice your life without fair compensation, then get thrown away when it suits him). The inability of Tesla to remove Musk from power merely confirms the obvious fact that he stacked the board with yes-men. I have nothing but disgust for the army of Tesla fanboys who claim any valid criticism is really just FUD spread by shorts. [/rant]
- r00fus 8y ago
  > Thus in his zealousness, he will sacrifice anything, especially actual humans, to accomplish his "goal". A bit hyperbolic, though the fact remains that he should consider strongly handing off the reins to a capable and trusted lieutenant (take a look at SpaceX - probably closer to his heart but run competently by Shotwell).
- Robin_Message 8y ago
  I understand he made a possibly illegal tweet to show off to his girlfriend, about and whilst on drugs, to the detriment of his company and his interests in it. That doesn't exactly smack of "sacrifice anything" - although you could modify your theory to some kind of cult leader-type complex, willing to sacrifice anyone else to the cause whilst having a good time themselves and it might fit quite well.

martythemaniak 8y ago

Well, it's now approximately 11 years since the infamous "Tesla Death Watch" series of blogposts. 11 years of constant "turmoil", "cash flow problems", "near bankruptcy", "Musk needs to quit", etc, etc, etc. Through these 11 years, they've gone from shipping a few hundred cars/year to hundreds of thousands of cars per year which are whole generation ahead of anything any other car manufacturer has been able to put out. Have you considered that maybe they're actually on a roll and doing just fine and this is mostly just tiresome media noise?

thisacctforreal 8y ago
Would love links to 11 year articles out of curiosity.
- leesec 8y ago
  https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2008/05/tesla-death-watch-tesla-hasnt-produced-any-real-cars-yet-broke-their-promise-on-starting-production-again-and-dont-plan-to-build-any-cars-for-another-year/ https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2008/05/tesla-death-watch-...
  - Theodores 8y ago
    That brings back memories. Haven't read anything there for a while. The TTAC death watch is here: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=thetruthaboutcars https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=thetruth... For comparison: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=tesla https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=tesla
FireBeyond 8y ago
Yes, there's a lot of media noise, tiresome or otherwise. BUT: 1) TESLA, not the media, were the ones they said they were closing ALL their retail stores, _a week ago_ - is this not newsworthy? and 2) TESLA, not the media, were the ones who said they're now NOT closing retail stores open, _a week later_ - is this also not newsworthy? If so, what makes them so trivial?

leesec 8y ago

If you want to just list only negative decisions made by Tesla or Musk and then call for Musk resignations that's fine. You could also list some of the positives from the company like having the best selling EV in the world or making the highest rated cars of all time. In which case it seems more like Musk is doing fine. Why so hysterical?

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

8bitsrule 8y ago

He needs to hand the reins over... His behavior ... shows a person who is mentally unfit to be a CEO. At least he isn't running a country.

RivieraKid 8y ago

DB gave them $500M so they can now pay wages and suppliers without closing the stores.

grizzles 8y ago

How? They changed their mind. No big deal. I'd say what it shows is a commitment to intellectualism above superficial factors like a prior company announcement. To do otherwise would be path dependence. So I see strength, not weakness. Hope they get their costs under control though. That's the key to everything in manufacturing.