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Forget China, think about yourself. If you have an option to fly on a 737 Max or another aircraft right now, which would you choose? I suspect market forces wil

Forget China, think about yourself. If you have an option to fly on a 737 Max or another aircraft right now, which would you choose? I suspect market forces will ground these planes anyway.

em3rgent0rdr 8y ago
I'd guesstimate flying on a 737 Max is still safer than driving a car.
- miemo 8y ago
  well driving a max is safer than a shark tasteless
- cjbprime 8y ago
  The actual option is going to be flying on a Max vs. choosing a different airline or flight number that uses a different model of plane.
  - amyjess 8y ago
    Yes, I've been toying around with the idea of booking a flight for later this year when I get paid on Friday, and I'm paying careful attention to the flight numbers on Southwest's website to make sure that whatever I pick won't be a MAX. (fortunately, the flights between DAL and LGA seem to be mostly 700s, at least during the time of year I want to travel)
- izzydata 8y ago
  The chance of getting in an accident when calculated by per mile driven and not by per drive is quite low.
fulafel 8y ago
Frequent air travelers are becoming self-selected for less planning/foresight than the average person wrt global warming concerns, I wonder if this changes the accident risk aversion of the average flyer.
bouncycastle 8y ago
Any aircraft can be stalled fairly easily. I think the problem may be between the yoke and the chair (PBYAC). Especially when it's a new aircraft, perhaps pilots need time to adjust, same as when you and I get in to a new car, it may have different response when you hit the gas, different mirrors, different sounds, different steering wheel sensitivity, etc.
- cjbprime 8y ago
  General aviation aircraft can be stalled easily. Stalling a commercial airliner takes much more effort, which is why it's so shocking when it actually happens.
  - bouncycastle 8y ago
    Exactly, it's "shocking". I guess that's why the pilots reacted the way they did - they didn't expect the stall & it was probably shocking for them, especially if they weren't properly trained for it or thinking that a stall is impossible or takes "much more effort than this". There's also been quite a few of these type of stalls documented in the past (eg. where the pitot tubes failed).
    - CydeWeys 8y ago
      This discussion is divorced from reality. These two fatal crashes were not caused by stalls. The first was for sure caused by MCAS incorrectly pitching the nose down and the second appears likely to share the same cause.
      - bouncycastle 8y ago
        Ok, I probably have no idea what I'm talking about. However, reading the early news reports, stories and comments, I don't think the journalists/commenters know either and some may be biased. Would be great to actually ask an experienced pilot who flies these things. The main thing I don't understand is, when a plane starts diving, first reaction would be to disable autopilot, and put the nose up, no? Also, pilots should be prepared to experience faulty sensors as they could fail at any time, no matter what model aircraft they are flying, no?
Aloha 8y ago
Depends on what the other aircraft is.
toephu2 8y ago
Why? Because 2 737s went down in the past few years? Do you know how many successful flights have been completed in the past few years? Would you rather drive? do you know how many people die in car accidents everyday? Over 3000. But it doesn't make the news because by definition it isn't new, it happens every day.
- markdown 8y ago
  > Because 2 737s went down in the past few years? Because 2 brand new 737s went down in the past 6 months and at least one of them was at least partially due to software.
- rsynnott 8y ago
  The point is that two of this currentlt rather rare 737 version went down in a year or so, for reasons which might be related. Up to you, of course, but personally I might opt for a 737-800 or A32x until the investigation is concluded. Both are plentiful.
- magpi3 8y ago
  If a specific car make and model was presumably more prone to automobile accidents people would have the same reaction towards it.
- piva00 8y ago
  Like other commenters added: it's not the 737 that has been flying for 4+ decades, this is a new update to the 737 that has been flying for less than 2 years, this version has had 2 catastrophic accidents since its first delivery on May 2017. Flying is safe because we had the time to learn from past accidents and create safeguards around their failures, this could be a new kind of failure we haven't been prepared for and if so there is a potential for risks higher than the usual.
- richardknop 8y ago
  > Why? Because 2 737s went down in the past few years? In last 6 months, to be more factual. 2 brand new aircraft of the latest model went down shortly after take off in less than 6 months. That is not normal and a proper investigation needs to take place. Until the investigation is done and it is proven that both of these crashes where just freak incidents and not caused by design flaw of the plane the planes should be grounded.

Forget China, think about yourself. If you have an option to fly on a 737 Max or another aircraft right now, which would you choose? I suspect market forces will ground these planes anyway.

em3rgent0rdr 8y ago

I'd guesstimate flying on a 737 Max is still safer than driving a car.

miemo 8y ago
well driving a max is safer than a shark tasteless
cjbprime 8y ago
The actual option is going to be flying on a Max vs. choosing a different airline or flight number that uses a different model of plane.
- amyjess 8y ago
  Yes, I've been toying around with the idea of booking a flight for later this year when I get paid on Friday, and I'm paying careful attention to the flight numbers on Southwest's website to make sure that whatever I pick won't be a MAX. (fortunately, the flights between DAL and LGA seem to be mostly 700s, at least during the time of year I want to travel)
izzydata 8y ago
The chance of getting in an accident when calculated by per mile driven and not by per drive is quite low.

fulafel 8y ago

Frequent air travelers are becoming self-selected for less planning/foresight than the average person wrt global warming concerns, I wonder if this changes the accident risk aversion of the average flyer.

bouncycastle 8y ago

Any aircraft can be stalled fairly easily. I think the problem may be between the yoke and the chair (PBYAC). Especially when it's a new aircraft, perhaps pilots need time to adjust, same as when you and I get in to a new car, it may have different response when you hit the gas, different mirrors, different sounds, different steering wheel sensitivity, etc.

cjbprime 8y ago
General aviation aircraft can be stalled easily. Stalling a commercial airliner takes much more effort, which is why it's so shocking when it actually happens.
- bouncycastle 8y ago
  Exactly, it's "shocking". I guess that's why the pilots reacted the way they did - they didn't expect the stall & it was probably shocking for them, especially if they weren't properly trained for it or thinking that a stall is impossible or takes "much more effort than this". There's also been quite a few of these type of stalls documented in the past (eg. where the pitot tubes failed).
  - CydeWeys 8y ago
    This discussion is divorced from reality. These two fatal crashes were not caused by stalls. The first was for sure caused by MCAS incorrectly pitching the nose down and the second appears likely to share the same cause.
    - bouncycastle 8y ago
      Ok, I probably have no idea what I'm talking about. However, reading the early news reports, stories and comments, I don't think the journalists/commenters know either and some may be biased. Would be great to actually ask an experienced pilot who flies these things. The main thing I don't understand is, when a plane starts diving, first reaction would be to disable autopilot, and put the nose up, no? Also, pilots should be prepared to experience faulty sensors as they could fail at any time, no matter what model aircraft they are flying, no?

Aloha 8y ago

Depends on what the other aircraft is.

toephu2 8y ago

Why? Because 2 737s went down in the past few years? Do you know how many successful flights have been completed in the past few years? Would you rather drive? do you know how many people die in car accidents everyday? Over 3000. But it doesn't make the news because by definition it isn't new, it happens every day.

markdown 8y ago
> Because 2 737s went down in the past few years? Because 2 brand new 737s went down in the past 6 months and at least one of them was at least partially due to software.
rsynnott 8y ago
The point is that two of this currentlt rather rare 737 version went down in a year or so, for reasons which might be related. Up to you, of course, but personally I might opt for a 737-800 or A32x until the investigation is concluded. Both are plentiful.
magpi3 8y ago
If a specific car make and model was presumably more prone to automobile accidents people would have the same reaction towards it.
piva00 8y ago
Like other commenters added: it's not the 737 that has been flying for 4+ decades, this is a new update to the 737 that has been flying for less than 2 years, this version has had 2 catastrophic accidents since its first delivery on May 2017. Flying is safe because we had the time to learn from past accidents and create safeguards around their failures, this could be a new kind of failure we haven't been prepared for and if so there is a potential for risks higher than the usual.
richardknop 8y ago
> Why? Because 2 737s went down in the past few years? In last 6 months, to be more factual. 2 brand new aircraft of the latest model went down shortly after take off in less than 6 months. That is not normal and a proper investigation needs to take place. Until the investigation is done and it is proven that both of these crashes where just freak incidents and not caused by design flaw of the plane the planes should be grounded.