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> Just don't tell me it's a hallucination until you've done it successfully yourself. I cannot resist, I've done meditation with never performing the out of bo

> Just don't tell me it's a hallucination until you've done it successfully yourself. I cannot resist, I've done meditation with never performing the out of body experience and I've read about it in great detail. I would still think the possibility of it all being a hallucination and even if performed with thinking it was definitely real. Hallucinations can be so real that they're impossible to disprove. Consciousness might not even be real in the sense that most people think about it as because reality tends to be deterministic with the impossibility to prove otherwise.

duncancarroll 8y ago
That's partly why I suggested people try it for themselves, because while I agree my personal subjective experience doesn't qualify as evidence one way or another for it being real / not real, it's much harder to dismiss once you've had it happen. FWIW, this wasn't actually my goal when I started meditating, it just happened after some months of regular meditation, and I had to piece together what it was from limited information. As you can see from the number of downvotes, there's still a strong prejudice against even the suggestion that these are valid experiences with potential utility. So it goes!
- bellerose 8y ago
  I don't doubt your experience or even the countless others who have had it happen and shared online. I just find it possible to be a trigger-able hallucination. Similar to what is possible with drugs. It's impossible to ever know if an out of body experience is real or a hallucination. I do find it interesting though. I think meditation is a healthy process to keep in one's arsenal of activities.
  - duncancarroll 8y ago
    I appreciate your open-mindedness. The only point I would make in reply is that is is possible to know if it's real or a hallucination, it just hasn't been thoroughly tested. It is possible to design an experiment to test the extent to which our normal world and this seemingly other space might intersect. It would also be possible, though ethically controversial, to test whether or not a person in an OBE state could reliably alternate between being pronounced dead, and then resuscitated. It would be a substantial finding to learn that someone could will themselves to both "die" and also to be revived. What is certain is that as meditation becomes more popular these experiences will become more common and no longer ridiculed. We will then learn more by virtue of level-headed people sharing information about them. Who knows what we'll find?

duncancarroll 8y ago

That's partly why I suggested people try it for themselves, because while I agree my personal subjective experience doesn't qualify as evidence one way or another for it being real / not real, it's much harder to dismiss once you've had it happen. FWIW, this wasn't actually my goal when I started meditating, it just happened after some months of regular meditation, and I had to piece together what it was from limited information. As you can see from the number of downvotes, there's still a strong prejudice against even the suggestion that these are valid experiences with potential utility. So it goes!

bellerose 8y ago
I don't doubt your experience or even the countless others who have had it happen and shared online. I just find it possible to be a trigger-able hallucination. Similar to what is possible with drugs. It's impossible to ever know if an out of body experience is real or a hallucination. I do find it interesting though. I think meditation is a healthy process to keep in one's arsenal of activities.
- duncancarroll 8y ago
  I appreciate your open-mindedness. The only point I would make in reply is that is is possible to know if it's real or a hallucination, it just hasn't been thoroughly tested. It is possible to design an experiment to test the extent to which our normal world and this seemingly other space might intersect. It would also be possible, though ethically controversial, to test whether or not a person in an OBE state could reliably alternate between being pronounced dead, and then resuscitated. It would be a substantial finding to learn that someone could will themselves to both "die" and also to be revived. What is certain is that as meditation becomes more popular these experiences will become more common and no longer ridiculed. We will then learn more by virtue of level-headed people sharing information about them. Who knows what we'll find?