6 ms·

I think that these patterns will become more common in areas where economic opportunity for all involved parties equalizes. We are seeing social problems arise

by moosey 8y ago

I think that these patterns will become more common in areas where economic opportunity for all involved parties equalizes. We are seeing social problems arise from this today, but hopefully those movements (incel, for example) begin to falter as the benefits from such a setup are realized. The idea that there are benefits to this are based on my personal point of view: I am married, I have two children, one adopted. While my marriage works, from my perspective, as a financial and management arrangement. However, it has failed in a variety of other areas that something like this would solve. Physical intimacy is an important aspect of human life, and finding reasonable access to it during our contemporary societal power shifts is going to be an ongoing problem. I expect to see more articles like this as people try to figure it out.

magduf 8y ago
>While my marriage works, from my perspective, as a financial and management arrangement. However, it has failed in a variety of other areas that something like this would solve. Sounds like you have a loveless marriage?
- moosey 8y ago
  Happens to tons of marriages for a variety of reasons. Fortunately, we are good friends and have a lot in common.
  - magduf 8y ago
    Sounds like me and my ex-wife. We're good friends, but that's it, and I wasn't willing to keep living like that. (We also had some serious points of conflict that made living in the same house unhappy.)
    - moosey 8y ago
      Right. I don't think that either of us intend to ever remarry. Our end goal now is two apartments that are close to each other in the same city that we are living in now, so that our children don't have any issues visiting us.
      - nate_meurer 8y ago
        You know, I really admire this. You have a mature and sophisticated approach to a problem that leads many other couples into some degree of bitter, hurtful conflict. You and your spouse are doing right by your kids, and taking care of yourselves too. With the self-awareness, strength, and honesty this takes, I expect things will work out just fine for you guys.
        magduf 8y ago
        I agree, except the part about not intending to remarry; that seems really sad to me.
        nate_meurer 8y ago
        But he didn't say he they would never again be in romantic relationships. Just that he didn't expect to enter another marriage agreement. I have older friends just like this. They divorced long ago, and the man's had one single girlfriend/partner ever since. He and GF live separately, but are together almost every day. They will never marry, because it would be pointless, and they carry far too much baggage to move in together; they're too particular about their space, too set in their routines, and have obligations that they don't care to subject each other to. I guess what I'm saying is that marriage and relationship are two different things. Institutional marriage offers some legal and financial advantages, and in some cases it's important as a way to fortify a couple's commitment. But in many relationships, like my friends', it serves no useful purpose.
        magduf 8y ago
        Living separately and being together "almost every day" seems to make little financial sense if you think marriage "serves no useful purpose": if you're spending that much time together, why wouldn't you just live together? You'll save a ton on living costs, plus maintaining a household requires a certain amount of time as well. No, you don't actually have to get legally married to live together, but for your example you are talking about people who aren't just unmarried, but also maintain two separate residences. I don't see how it's "pointless"; if you're so particular about your space or set in your routine to live together, then how do you manage to "be together" for so much time? Do these people live next door to each other or something? Just the driving time alone is going to add up.
- unclebucknasty 8y ago
  The Western notion of marriage is somewhat skewed towards prioritizing feeling "in love" first, then acting accordingly. Once you realize that love is a choice and an action/behavior, it generally sorts itself out. The funny thing is that the feeling of being in love soon follows. A good friend who married before I did once told me that, and I thought it sounded a little crazy. Then, I got married and understood.
  - stcredzero 8y ago
    Here in the West, romantic love has seemingly been canonized. It's something which our culture effectively worships as some kind of oracle of an ultimate underlying truth. This is also why there is so much irrational thinking and bad thinking around love, romance, and relationships here. Love is indeed a profound experience which will change how you view the world. However, Love is not a god. It's not an oracle unto truth. It's not to be worshiped. It's not a reason to turn off your rational brain. Anyone telling you otherwise, especially about that last one, is either trying to sell you something, or was told that by someone who is. (I suspect you're being downvoted by such zealots.) The feeling of romantic love is a part of a greater whole. A relationship has other sides to it, like the companionate and practical aspects.
kuhhk 8y ago
Have you tried marriage counseling?
- moosey 8y ago
  We have accepted the state of our marriage as it is today. The libido mismatch has some medical background, so it's not as if we are cruel to each other. We do sacrifice, but we do it for the children that we have chosen to have. We both accept that this marriage will end once they are done with HS.
  - ekovarski 8y ago
    Is there a reason to postpone it until the kids finish high school? I tend to see a lot of this reasoning but never truly understood especially if both of you are on the same page.
    - jcims 8y ago
      Probably to maximize the time they both have with the kids and to minimize the impact to the kids’ lives during a time that’s already fraught with anxiety and doubt.
circlefavshape 8y ago
I recommend to you the works of Esther Perel.
skoskie 8y ago
/r/deadbedrooms Physical intimacy is not just sex. I can’t imagine (within reason) a medical condition that would prevent one from grabbing their SO’s ass every once in a while to remind them they are still thought of in that way. Good for you for sticking it out for the kids. I hope you find happiness eventually, in any way it avails itself.

by moosey 8y ago

magduf 8y ago

>While my marriage works, from my perspective, as a financial and management arrangement. However, it has failed in a variety of other areas that something like this would solve. Sounds like you have a loveless marriage?

moosey 8y ago
Happens to tons of marriages for a variety of reasons. Fortunately, we are good friends and have a lot in common.
- magduf 8y ago
  Sounds like me and my ex-wife. We're good friends, but that's it, and I wasn't willing to keep living like that. (We also had some serious points of conflict that made living in the same house unhappy.)
  - moosey 8y ago
    Right. I don't think that either of us intend to ever remarry. Our end goal now is two apartments that are close to each other in the same city that we are living in now, so that our children don't have any issues visiting us.
    - nate_meurer 8y ago
      You know, I really admire this. You have a mature and sophisticated approach to a problem that leads many other couples into some degree of bitter, hurtful conflict. You and your spouse are doing right by your kids, and taking care of yourselves too. With the self-awareness, strength, and honesty this takes, I expect things will work out just fine for you guys.
      - magduf 8y ago
        I agree, except the part about not intending to remarry; that seems really sad to me.
        nate_meurer 8y ago
        But he didn't say he they would never again be in romantic relationships. Just that he didn't expect to enter another marriage agreement. I have older friends just like this. They divorced long ago, and the man's had one single girlfriend/partner ever since. He and GF live separately, but are together almost every day. They will never marry, because it would be pointless, and they carry far too much baggage to move in together; they're too particular about their space, too set in their routines, and have obligations that they don't care to subject each other to. I guess what I'm saying is that marriage and relationship are two different things. Institutional marriage offers some legal and financial advantages, and in some cases it's important as a way to fortify a couple's commitment. But in many relationships, like my friends', it serves no useful purpose.
        magduf 8y ago
        Living separately and being together "almost every day" seems to make little financial sense if you think marriage "serves no useful purpose": if you're spending that much time together, why wouldn't you just live together? You'll save a ton on living costs, plus maintaining a household requires a certain amount of time as well. No, you don't actually have to get legally married to live together, but for your example you are talking about people who aren't just unmarried, but also maintain two separate residences. I don't see how it's "pointless"; if you're so particular about your space or set in your routine to live together, then how do you manage to "be together" for so much time? Do these people live next door to each other or something? Just the driving time alone is going to add up.
unclebucknasty 8y ago
The Western notion of marriage is somewhat skewed towards prioritizing feeling "in love" first, then acting accordingly. Once you realize that love is a choice and an action/behavior, it generally sorts itself out. The funny thing is that the feeling of being in love soon follows. A good friend who married before I did once told me that, and I thought it sounded a little crazy. Then, I got married and understood.
- stcredzero 8y ago
  Here in the West, romantic love has seemingly been canonized. It's something which our culture effectively worships as some kind of oracle of an ultimate underlying truth. This is also why there is so much irrational thinking and bad thinking around love, romance, and relationships here. Love is indeed a profound experience which will change how you view the world. However, Love is not a god. It's not an oracle unto truth. It's not to be worshiped. It's not a reason to turn off your rational brain. Anyone telling you otherwise, especially about that last one, is either trying to sell you something, or was told that by someone who is. (I suspect you're being downvoted by such zealots.) The feeling of romantic love is a part of a greater whole. A relationship has other sides to it, like the companionate and practical aspects.

kuhhk 8y ago

Have you tried marriage counseling?

moosey 8y ago
We have accepted the state of our marriage as it is today. The libido mismatch has some medical background, so it's not as if we are cruel to each other. We do sacrifice, but we do it for the children that we have chosen to have. We both accept that this marriage will end once they are done with HS.
- ekovarski 8y ago
  Is there a reason to postpone it until the kids finish high school? I tend to see a lot of this reasoning but never truly understood especially if both of you are on the same page.
  - jcims 8y ago
    Probably to maximize the time they both have with the kids and to minimize the impact to the kids’ lives during a time that’s already fraught with anxiety and doubt.

circlefavshape 8y ago

I recommend to you the works of Esther Perel.

skoskie 8y ago

/r/deadbedrooms Physical intimacy is not just sex. I can’t imagine (within reason) a medical condition that would prevent one from grabbing their SO’s ass every once in a while to remind them they are still thought of in that way. Good for you for sticking it out for the kids. I hope you find happiness eventually, in any way it avails itself.