5 ms·

Israel uses Facebook to catch 1,000 draft dodgers

32 points by MarinaMartin 16y ago

MarinaMartin 16y ago
I really expected this article to be about photos of these draft dodgers drinking booze, making out with a guy, etc. But updating your Facebook profile on the Sabbath? That's hardcore attention to detail, Israel.
- mooism2 16y ago
  Checking when an update was posted strikes me as being easier to automate than checking photo contents.
- cycojesus 16y ago
  They were exempted from serving in the military on the basis that they're "religiously observant". That excludes using a computer on sabbath and eating in non-kosher restaurants. Lie exposed → Exemption revoked.
scrrr 16y ago
Next thing you know they'll post their position to Facebook by accident and opponents will shoot rockets at them.
alkavan 16y ago
this is sad really, i served in IDF for 3 years, trained Infantry, learned so much stuff out there and wouldn't replace this time for anything. now our youngsters just lie they religious to the army to skip it, but not because they are "flower children" who make peace and not war, it's because they are lazy fuc*kers who what to play the iPhone all day and watch TV and do nothing. that's a great idea really, because if you're true religious, means you can't use any electrical stuff, not computers and not phones on Sabbath, and if you're updated your FB page you're just a lier.
semuelf 16y ago
this is quite a problematic topic in Israel. There are two point of views in the the country, Ashkenazy-European and Sfarady-Eastern. The European point of view is that religion in true-false question. either you are religious or you are one. The Eastern point of view is the religion is more of a scale. you can accept some of the rules of the religion, skip the rest, and still be religious person. The army obviously want to go the European way, as it gives it a clear definition that it can work with. On the other hand, the Eastern point of view is backed by a strong political force, so it is a very fine line that the army is walking on. it need to be very careful before accusing a girl of lying of being religious. (and yes, when it makes mistakes it become a political argument. very messy) All this and not a word about what about a religious girl that sometime after declaring itself as so decide to become not religious.
mhd 16y ago
Couldn't she have hired some gentile to do the typing? Other than the "light a fire" thingy, I can't imagine Facebook being against any "work on the Sabbath" law. I'd actually propose that any minute spent on Facebook counts as some kind of indulgence for the purpose of work (Yes, I know, I'm mixing religions all willy-nilly now).
- tkahn6 16y ago
  Actually that "light a fire thingy" applies to electronics. And for multiple reasons I highly doubt she hired a gentile to update her Facebook status (who would be reading it?).
  - mhd 16y ago
    I know that it applies, so I just wondered (tongue in cheek) whether hiring a shabbos goy for Facebook updates would be, well, kosher.
    - tkahn6 16y ago
      That's a good question. I have 'orthodox' friends that have timers on their TVs to come on during Shabbat. I don't keep shabbat but that would seem to defeat the purpose IMO.
iwr 16y ago
This may sound harsh, but an army of slaves (i.e. conscripts) is incompatible with a free country. If the citizens can't be mustered to volunteer in its defense, the current state as a social organization becomes obsolete. Granted, there are many Israelis who would indeed volunteer and militarily, they are not in danger.
- tkahn6 16y ago
  This may be orthogonal to your point, but understand that only the willing actually serve in combat roles. Granted all go through basic training and then reserve training periodically after they finish their service, but that's because in a time of real existential danger, everyone fights.
  - idan 16y ago
    Um, no. If you are certified as combat-capable, and you are placed with a combat unit, you must go. If you refuse, you go to army jail. Army jail time does not count as service time, so when you get out of army jail, you still have a term of service to complete.
    - snotrockets 16y ago
      Luckily, after about six months to a year of jail time (used to be less. A friend spent more than a year,) the army deems you unfit to serve, and you are exempt from service.
    - endtime 16y ago
      That may be true, but not for women. The article only mentions catching women, who (I believe) have multiple non-military options for their national service.
      - snotrockets 16y ago
        Not so. In Israel, military service is compulsory for women as well, and there is no option for non-military compulsory national service. Non-military national service is voluntarily open to those exempt from military service for various reasons. But it isn't a must, and you can be exempt from military service, and not do any national service.

32 points by MarinaMartin 16y ago

I really expected this article to be about photos of these draft dodgers drinking booze, making out with a guy, etc. But updating your Facebook profile on the Sabbath? That's hardcore attention to detail, Israel.

mooism2 16y ago
Checking when an update was posted strikes me as being easier to automate than checking photo contents.
cycojesus 16y ago
They were exempted from serving in the military on the basis that they're "religiously observant". That excludes using a computer on sabbath and eating in non-kosher restaurants. Lie exposed → Exemption revoked.

scrrr 16y ago

Next thing you know they'll post their position to Facebook by accident and opponents will shoot rockets at them.

alkavan 16y ago

this is sad really, i served in IDF for 3 years, trained Infantry, learned so much stuff out there and wouldn't replace this time for anything. now our youngsters just lie they religious to the army to skip it, but not because they are "flower children" who make peace and not war, it's because they are lazy fuc*kers who what to play the iPhone all day and watch TV and do nothing. that's a great idea really, because if you're true religious, means you can't use any electrical stuff, not computers and not phones on Sabbath, and if you're updated your FB page you're just a lier.

semuelf 16y ago

this is quite a problematic topic in Israel. There are two point of views in the the country, Ashkenazy-European and Sfarady-Eastern. The European point of view is that religion in true-false question. either you are religious or you are one. The Eastern point of view is the religion is more of a scale. you can accept some of the rules of the religion, skip the rest, and still be religious person. The army obviously want to go the European way, as it gives it a clear definition that it can work with. On the other hand, the Eastern point of view is backed by a strong political force, so it is a very fine line that the army is walking on. it need to be very careful before accusing a girl of lying of being religious. (and yes, when it makes mistakes it become a political argument. very messy) All this and not a word about what about a religious girl that sometime after declaring itself as so decide to become not religious.

mhd 16y ago

Couldn't she have hired some gentile to do the typing? Other than the "light a fire" thingy, I can't imagine Facebook being against any "work on the Sabbath" law. I'd actually propose that any minute spent on Facebook counts as some kind of indulgence for the purpose of work (Yes, I know, I'm mixing religions all willy-nilly now).

tkahn6 16y ago
Actually that "light a fire thingy" applies to electronics. And for multiple reasons I highly doubt she hired a gentile to update her Facebook status (who would be reading it?).
- mhd 16y ago
  I know that it applies, so I just wondered (tongue in cheek) whether hiring a shabbos goy for Facebook updates would be, well, kosher.
  - tkahn6 16y ago
    That's a good question. I have 'orthodox' friends that have timers on their TVs to come on during Shabbat. I don't keep shabbat but that would seem to defeat the purpose IMO.

iwr 16y ago

This may sound harsh, but an army of slaves (i.e. conscripts) is incompatible with a free country. If the citizens can't be mustered to volunteer in its defense, the current state as a social organization becomes obsolete. Granted, there are many Israelis who would indeed volunteer and militarily, they are not in danger.

tkahn6 16y ago
This may be orthogonal to your point, but understand that only the willing actually serve in combat roles. Granted all go through basic training and then reserve training periodically after they finish their service, but that's because in a time of real existential danger, everyone fights.
- idan 16y ago
  Um, no. If you are certified as combat-capable, and you are placed with a combat unit, you must go. If you refuse, you go to army jail. Army jail time does not count as service time, so when you get out of army jail, you still have a term of service to complete.
  - snotrockets 16y ago
    Luckily, after about six months to a year of jail time (used to be less. A friend spent more than a year,) the army deems you unfit to serve, and you are exempt from service.
  - endtime 16y ago
    That may be true, but not for women. The article only mentions catching women, who (I believe) have multiple non-military options for their national service.
    - snotrockets 16y ago
      Not so. In Israel, military service is compulsory for women as well, and there is no option for non-military compulsory national service. Non-military national service is voluntarily open to those exempt from military service for various reasons. But it isn't a must, and you can be exempt from military service, and not do any national service.