6 ms·

It's going to be interesting over the next 10 years to see the outcomes of these experiments in terms of long term behavior change in the population. It's a goo

It's going to be interesting over the next 10 years to see the outcomes of these experiments in terms of long term behavior change in the population. It's a good time to be a social psychologist in China.

linkmotif 8y ago
Unless you have something to say that contradicts party ideology. Then you might lose your ability to travel.
afpx 8y ago
Eventually, these policies will eliminate their ability to innovate and advance.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- scottlocklin 8y ago
  That sounds like wishful thinking. The US certainly does soft punishment of dissidents and doesn't seem to hurt itself much on the innovation front. I mean, innovation is definitely lower than before, but still better than everyone else.
  - afpx 8y ago
    What do you mean by soft punishment? The United States is a great place to be a dissident. Dissident behavior is kind of expected, and historically, they’ve been iconified.
    - scottlocklin 8y ago
      No, actually, other than something like the communist film writers of the 1950s (who obviously had a better publicity department than most), most American dissidents have been forgotten. Soft punishment means you don't let them get jobs doing what they're good at. Like commie writers in the 50s.
      - afpx 8y ago
        It’s never an easy life to be a radical against the establishment. But, there’s plenty of tolerance for such behavior (especially if the behavior is non-violent). Even during 50s. McCarthyism was a knee jerk reaction to the Cold War. And, it was quickly rectified. Our culture encourages thinking differently and speaking out - just consider our history of music, literature, film, comedy, political dissent, etc.
        scottlocklin 8y ago
        I dunno, sounds like happy talk to me. It's definitely part of the english speaking people's self conception that "thinking different and speaking out" is encouraged, but it really isn't any more than in any other society. Consider the Comstocks, the people who were against US entry into WW-1, the "brown scare" which started the HUAC, people who are presently against various wars in the middle east (denounced as "racists" or "Russian sock puppets"), or various recent coups and attempts at such (ditto); these people were and are squashed fairly mercilessly by the establishment. The actual bounds of allowable discussion are narrow and strictly enforced. Hell, US persists in passing anti-BDS laws that are obviously and egregiously unconstitutional, and the British throw people in prison for saying things ... on FB. It's a kinder, gentler system than used by the Chinese, but the end result isn't any different.
        afpx 8y ago
        I’ll admit that I’m probably biased, and I haven’t had enough experience living outside of the US to have gained a different perspective. But, now I’m curious. Which countries are currently and historically known for being tolerant and accepting of dissent? Honest question - I’ve been considering retirement lately, and I’m up for a new adventure.
        scottlocklin 8y ago
        If I had to rank them, I think Iceland is the most tolerant country. Assuming you know how to use the Icelandic-correct way to use Sauna and the Hot tub. Generally speaking I think smaller countries are better for this; dissent becomes a judgement on a personal level which is almost always more generous than on a societal level. In Iceland I heard many times, "I knew Bobby Fischer, he was a nice man." In America we still think of him as some kind of demon because ... I dunno, he said things I guess. Reality was he didn't bother anyone which is more than you can say for virtually any US politicians. Personally I don't look at things this "what is most tolerant" way. You don't pick the country which is tolerant and accepting of dissent: this is a futile exercise. You pick the country which best fits your views.
rqs 8y ago
> good time to be a social psychologist in China Are you sure about the good time?

linkmotif 8y ago

Unless you have something to say that contradicts party ideology. Then you might lose your ability to travel.

afpx 8y ago

Eventually, these policies will eliminate their ability to innovate and advance.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
scottlocklin 8y ago
That sounds like wishful thinking. The US certainly does soft punishment of dissidents and doesn't seem to hurt itself much on the innovation front. I mean, innovation is definitely lower than before, but still better than everyone else.
- afpx 8y ago
  What do you mean by soft punishment? The United States is a great place to be a dissident. Dissident behavior is kind of expected, and historically, they’ve been iconified.
  - scottlocklin 8y ago
    No, actually, other than something like the communist film writers of the 1950s (who obviously had a better publicity department than most), most American dissidents have been forgotten. Soft punishment means you don't let them get jobs doing what they're good at. Like commie writers in the 50s.
    - afpx 8y ago
      It’s never an easy life to be a radical against the establishment. But, there’s plenty of tolerance for such behavior (especially if the behavior is non-violent). Even during 50s. McCarthyism was a knee jerk reaction to the Cold War. And, it was quickly rectified. Our culture encourages thinking differently and speaking out - just consider our history of music, literature, film, comedy, political dissent, etc.
      - scottlocklin 8y ago
        I dunno, sounds like happy talk to me. It's definitely part of the english speaking people's self conception that "thinking different and speaking out" is encouraged, but it really isn't any more than in any other society. Consider the Comstocks, the people who were against US entry into WW-1, the "brown scare" which started the HUAC, people who are presently against various wars in the middle east (denounced as "racists" or "Russian sock puppets"), or various recent coups and attempts at such (ditto); these people were and are squashed fairly mercilessly by the establishment. The actual bounds of allowable discussion are narrow and strictly enforced. Hell, US persists in passing anti-BDS laws that are obviously and egregiously unconstitutional, and the British throw people in prison for saying things ... on FB. It's a kinder, gentler system than used by the Chinese, but the end result isn't any different.
        afpx 8y ago
        I’ll admit that I’m probably biased, and I haven’t had enough experience living outside of the US to have gained a different perspective. But, now I’m curious. Which countries are currently and historically known for being tolerant and accepting of dissent? Honest question - I’ve been considering retirement lately, and I’m up for a new adventure.
        scottlocklin 8y ago
        If I had to rank them, I think Iceland is the most tolerant country. Assuming you know how to use the Icelandic-correct way to use Sauna and the Hot tub. Generally speaking I think smaller countries are better for this; dissent becomes a judgement on a personal level which is almost always more generous than on a societal level. In Iceland I heard many times, "I knew Bobby Fischer, he was a nice man." In America we still think of him as some kind of demon because ... I dunno, he said things I guess. Reality was he didn't bother anyone which is more than you can say for virtually any US politicians. Personally I don't look at things this "what is most tolerant" way. You don't pick the country which is tolerant and accepting of dissent: this is a futile exercise. You pick the country which best fits your views.

rqs 8y ago

> good time to be a social psychologist in China Are you sure about the good time?