5 ms·

It's about time we admit the emperor has no clothes. BTC/ETH/XYY/123 can store value (I don't care to get into the fluctuations right now) and moving it around

It's about time we admit the emperor has no clothes. BTC/ETH/XYY/123 can store value (I don't care to get into the fluctuations right now) and moving it around can be a lot easier than outdated systems like ACH but they are terrible for paying for things. Maybe something like the lightning network or similar will be able to solve part of that but accepting BTC has always been more of a fad/PR-move than an actual business decision. Unless you are running in the gray/dark web (Silk Road-type, Torrent/nzb trackers, seedboxes, etc) your customers are not going to jump through the hoops required to spend BTC.

eropple 8y ago
> moving it around can be a lot easier than outdated systems like ACH To be specific: a lot easier than outdated systems in the United States. If you do any work outside the United States, this is much less of a thing.
legionof7 8y ago
Gray/dark web stuff is different in America/most European countries than in other parts of the world though. Just because something is perfectly legal here, doesn't mean that it's the same elsewhere.
tim333 8y ago
>Maybe something like the lightning network or similar will be able to solve part The article mentions they also take Dash which transacts pretty much instantly for less than 1c but still hasn't taken off apart from maybe a few outlets in Venezuela.
Ruphin 8y ago
Users that already have a Bitcoin wallet don't have to jump through any hoops to spend BTC. It's just as easy as any kind of digital money transfer. Obviously using BTC to pay for anything is a huge hassle if you don't already have a wallet with some BTC in it. But that's like saying Apple Pay is inconvenient because your customers have to go to and buy an iPhone first.
- scrumbledober 8y ago
  except i don't need to wait for blockchain confirmations on apple pay, it's instant.
  - whttheuuu 8y ago
    Confirmations are pretty quick now. And with Lightning is instant.
  - sparkie 8y ago
    It's also reversible. With bitcoin, it might take a bit longer, but transaction are non-reversible after a few confirmations. Any other system can reverse payments even 6 months down the line. Sucks for businesses.
    - bluejellybean 8y ago
      I've heard this argument a few times now and while yes this is true for Bitcoin, there is nothing stopping another project from implementing this feature. Smart contracts, for example, make this type of feature open to any developer who wishes to code it. In my view, Bitcoin is like MySQL and cryptocurrency/blockchain is SQL. Sure bitcoin has specific limitations but any other generic cryptocurrency doesn't have to implement features in the same way.
      - sparkie 8y ago
        "Blockchain" is a database, but bitcoin is much more than its storage backend. The reason you can't simply replicate it is due to the monetary policy. In a world where anyone can make their own cryptocurrency, and we have "bluejellybeanBucks" and "sparkieSterling", how much value are these silly currencies going to have? Their value will converge towards zero as more of them are printed and less of them are actually useful for representing value. The whole point of Bitcoin was to solve this inflation problem. If you don't care about inflation, you don't need a "blockchain" to begin with. Bitcoin has the network effects, and it also required the creation (inflation) of some initial set of distributed digital asset because it was the first of its kind, and could not piggyback off of some other scarce, verifiable asset. Every other "cryptocurrency" that came afterwards, could piggyback of a scarce digital asset and avoid the inflation problem. They had Bitcoin to piggyback off. In future, all "blockchain" projects will be implemented as sidechains to bitcoin, or as payment networks which transact in Bitcoin and therefore don't create inflation by design. Things like the Liquid sidechain, Sidechain One (drivechains), Rootstock, Lightning network, etc. These are the "implementations" which will be competing for users, but they'll all be functioning on the same currency, because any currency other than Bitcoin is destined to lose value with time, due to the inflation they designed into their system.
observer12 8y ago
ACH is slow by design. It could take milliseconds if desired.

eropple 8y ago

> moving it around can be a lot easier than outdated systems like ACH To be specific: a lot easier than outdated systems in the United States. If you do any work outside the United States, this is much less of a thing.

legionof7 8y ago

Gray/dark web stuff is different in America/most European countries than in other parts of the world though. Just because something is perfectly legal here, doesn't mean that it's the same elsewhere.

tim333 8y ago

>Maybe something like the lightning network or similar will be able to solve part The article mentions they also take Dash which transacts pretty much instantly for less than 1c but still hasn't taken off apart from maybe a few outlets in Venezuela.

Ruphin 8y ago

Users that already have a Bitcoin wallet don't have to jump through any hoops to spend BTC. It's just as easy as any kind of digital money transfer. Obviously using BTC to pay for anything is a huge hassle if you don't already have a wallet with some BTC in it. But that's like saying Apple Pay is inconvenient because your customers have to go to and buy an iPhone first.

scrumbledober 8y ago
except i don't need to wait for blockchain confirmations on apple pay, it's instant.
- whttheuuu 8y ago
  Confirmations are pretty quick now. And with Lightning is instant.
- sparkie 8y ago
  It's also reversible. With bitcoin, it might take a bit longer, but transaction are non-reversible after a few confirmations. Any other system can reverse payments even 6 months down the line. Sucks for businesses.
  - bluejellybean 8y ago
    I've heard this argument a few times now and while yes this is true for Bitcoin, there is nothing stopping another project from implementing this feature. Smart contracts, for example, make this type of feature open to any developer who wishes to code it. In my view, Bitcoin is like MySQL and cryptocurrency/blockchain is SQL. Sure bitcoin has specific limitations but any other generic cryptocurrency doesn't have to implement features in the same way.
    - sparkie 8y ago
      "Blockchain" is a database, but bitcoin is much more than its storage backend. The reason you can't simply replicate it is due to the monetary policy. In a world where anyone can make their own cryptocurrency, and we have "bluejellybeanBucks" and "sparkieSterling", how much value are these silly currencies going to have? Their value will converge towards zero as more of them are printed and less of them are actually useful for representing value. The whole point of Bitcoin was to solve this inflation problem. If you don't care about inflation, you don't need a "blockchain" to begin with. Bitcoin has the network effects, and it also required the creation (inflation) of some initial set of distributed digital asset because it was the first of its kind, and could not piggyback off of some other scarce, verifiable asset. Every other "cryptocurrency" that came afterwards, could piggyback of a scarce digital asset and avoid the inflation problem. They had Bitcoin to piggyback off. In future, all "blockchain" projects will be implemented as sidechains to bitcoin, or as payment networks which transact in Bitcoin and therefore don't create inflation by design. Things like the Liquid sidechain, Sidechain One (drivechains), Rootstock, Lightning network, etc. These are the "implementations" which will be competing for users, but they'll all be functioning on the same currency, because any currency other than Bitcoin is destined to lose value with time, due to the inflation they designed into their system.

observer12 8y ago

ACH is slow by design. It could take milliseconds if desired.