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> a test drive prior to purchase isn’t needed. You can now return a car within 7 days or 1,000 miles for a full refund Call me old fashioned, but that is in no

> a test drive prior to purchase isn’t needed. You can now return a car within 7 days or 1,000 miles for a full refund Call me old fashioned, but that is in no way a better alternative to a test drive prior to commitment.

ocdtrekkie 8y ago
Indeed: Usually I make test drives when deciding which car to buy, not to ensure my choice was the right one. When people can't test drive a Tesla, they aren't going to go "well, I can always return it". They're going to buy the best car they test drive. While helping someone pick a car recently, we test drove two different models of car from the same company multiple times as well, to decide which one was the right one. It's not like Tesla's going to send out a Model 3, a Model S, and a Model X and let me try all three.
- gregmac 8y ago
  > It's not like Tesla's going to send out a Model 3, a Model S, and a Model X and let me try all three. You're trying to optimize for buying the cheapest Tesla that will work for you. Tesla is trying to optimize for making the most money they can from you. If you can not only afford a Model X but are seriously considering it, why would they put effort into possibly selling you a Model 3?
  - leereeves 8y ago
    Because the Model 3 isn't your only cheaper alternative to the Model X.
- AdrianB1 8y ago
  You must be very undecided if you want to try all, they are very different cars in terms of size and price. Or is the choice "should I buy an X or 3 M3's?"
jonny_eh 8y ago
Certainly makes it hard to shop around between multiple cars. What do they expect you to do, buy each car, in turn. Return all of them within 7 days. Then re-purchase the one you preferred?
- dragonwriter 8y ago
  > What do they expect you to do, buy each car, in turn. Return all of them within 7 days. Then re-purchase the one you preferred? No, they expect you to buy all of them in parallel and return all but the one you want. I mean, it’s the model lots of people have been using with clothing since online discount retailers with generous return policy started undercutting brick-and-mortar.
  - alkibiades 8y ago
    buying 3 cars is a little different than t shirts
    - dragonwriter 8y ago
      The implication that the extension of the expectation from online clothing retail to online automobile retail was unreasonable was intended, yes.
  - ypzhang2 8y ago
    There's a big difference in cost and complexity between buying a car online and buying clothing online though, especially if financing is involved (not many people are going to have the cash on hand to float on 2-3 vehicles at any one time).
  - jjulius 8y ago
    I can have 7 shirts shipped to my house and they take up a very small footprint. If I'm trying to decide between 7 cars, I'm going to have a hard time finding a place to put all of them, as will most people. That's on top of having to deal with financing multiple cars just to test drive them all.
Zanni 8y ago
They're still offering test drives, just not in as many locations as before (also, FWIW, Tesla owners tend to be very generous in letting friends and acquaintances, sometimes total strangers, test drive their personal vehicles). There are a lot of people who just want a Tesla. They're not shopping around to find the best car. Offering a refund means those people can buy with confidence, knowing they can return it if it's not all they expected.
- hnmonkey 8y ago
  Where are you getting that people who own a Tesla sometimes are very generous and let strangers test drive their cars? I can't imagine a scenario where anyone would go for that given how expensive they are and how that kind of thing just doesn't happen with cars in general.
  - cbhl 8y ago
    If I recall correctly, the SF Bay Area has quite a few Teslas on Getaround...
  - Zanni 8y ago
    Personal experience. Tesla owners tend to be so stoked on their cars that they want to share the experience. Seriously. I've seen multiple requests and offers on Tesla forums and apparently it's pretty common at Tesla meet-ups as well.
    - hnmonkey 8y ago
      That is wild. I've never heard of anything like that before with cars.
  - londons_explore 8y ago
    This varies by country. In Europe, cars are pretty personal items, and typically only insured for one or a few drivers. Lending your car to a friend for a day would typically involve hours on the phone to the insurance company and a few hundred euros of fees. There are apps (cuvva) which try to reduce this, but even so it'll probably be cheaper and less effort to call an Uber rather than borrow a friend's car. In the USA, loaning a car to a friend or neighbor seems far more common.
atwebb 8y ago
Wait for "brand ambassadors", gig economy for test drives.
goshx 8y ago
I am not sure if I understood what you meant, but they are not implying that you should buy first and then drive. The policy is about giving more time to return the car if the customer didn't do a test drive before. At Model 3's early days, a lot of people bought the car without having the option to take one out for a test drive.
gpmcadam 8y ago
Wish they'd just let you rent cars instead. A test drive is too short. And a 7 day period is too big a commitment. Why not let me pay to rent a car, like a normal rental car place, and pay per day. Would be cool to do anyway, but I bet a lot of people would end up falling in love with the car that way and become owners shortly after.
- sliken 8y ago
  I used (but am not affiliated with) Turo.com to rent a model S for 2 days.
- derekp7 8y ago
  That is exactly how I ended up deciding on my current car. When my old vehicle was in for service, I drove the car I was considering purchasing as a rental for 3 days and really fell in love with all aspects of it (in my case a Fusion).
sliken 8y ago
Dunno. I hate test drives, WAY too short to really learn much beyond a general idea of performance and how comfortable the seats are. Buying a new car for $$$ (I keep them for at least 10 years, currently 14) is a pretty big commitment for a 10-20 minute test drive. Imagine getting married after a 20 minute date. I rented a model S for 2 days, I was still learning things about it when I returned it.
- paranoidrobot 8y ago
  I guess Tesla is different, but many dealers will let you take the car for a day or two for a longer test drive if you're serious about buying the car from them. eg to make sure the car fits in you garage, it's convenient for picking up the kids, etc.
  - sliken 8y ago
    So far I bought a Acura Integra GSR, Subaru WRX, and Subaru Forester XT. It required some cajoling to get even a short test drive, even when buying a second car from the same dealer. All 3 cars were pretty hot at the time, all 3 won car of the year or similar awards in the year I got them. I suspect if cars are in demand (and don't spend many days on the dealer lot) they minimize the test drives. If they spend months on the lot they are more generous with the test drives.
7e 8y ago
This means that when you buy online, it's possible you'll be delivered someone else's 1,000 mile return. There's a reason Tesla delays titling their cars; that allows them to resell returns as new.
- eeeeeeeeeeeee 8y ago
  I was wondering the same thing. Where do all these returns go?
Daviey 8y ago
I organised a test drive, with no intention of buying the car. It was just as an "experience" day for the family.... I enjoyed it so much, I then bought a Model S. I wouldn't have bought without the test drive.

ocdtrekkie 8y ago

Indeed: Usually I make test drives when deciding which car to buy, not to ensure my choice was the right one. When people can't test drive a Tesla, they aren't going to go "well, I can always return it". They're going to buy the best car they test drive. While helping someone pick a car recently, we test drove two different models of car from the same company multiple times as well, to decide which one was the right one. It's not like Tesla's going to send out a Model 3, a Model S, and a Model X and let me try all three.

gregmac 8y ago
> It's not like Tesla's going to send out a Model 3, a Model S, and a Model X and let me try all three. You're trying to optimize for buying the cheapest Tesla that will work for you. Tesla is trying to optimize for making the most money they can from you. If you can not only afford a Model X but are seriously considering it, why would they put effort into possibly selling you a Model 3?
- leereeves 8y ago
  Because the Model 3 isn't your only cheaper alternative to the Model X.
AdrianB1 8y ago
You must be very undecided if you want to try all, they are very different cars in terms of size and price. Or is the choice "should I buy an X or 3 M3's?"

jonny_eh 8y ago

Certainly makes it hard to shop around between multiple cars. What do they expect you to do, buy each car, in turn. Return all of them within 7 days. Then re-purchase the one you preferred?

dragonwriter 8y ago
> What do they expect you to do, buy each car, in turn. Return all of them within 7 days. Then re-purchase the one you preferred? No, they expect you to buy all of them in parallel and return all but the one you want. I mean, it’s the model lots of people have been using with clothing since online discount retailers with generous return policy started undercutting brick-and-mortar.
- alkibiades 8y ago
  buying 3 cars is a little different than t shirts
  - dragonwriter 8y ago
    The implication that the extension of the expectation from online clothing retail to online automobile retail was unreasonable was intended, yes.
- ypzhang2 8y ago
  There's a big difference in cost and complexity between buying a car online and buying clothing online though, especially if financing is involved (not many people are going to have the cash on hand to float on 2-3 vehicles at any one time).
- jjulius 8y ago
  I can have 7 shirts shipped to my house and they take up a very small footprint. If I'm trying to decide between 7 cars, I'm going to have a hard time finding a place to put all of them, as will most people. That's on top of having to deal with financing multiple cars just to test drive them all.

Zanni 8y ago

They're still offering test drives, just not in as many locations as before (also, FWIW, Tesla owners tend to be very generous in letting friends and acquaintances, sometimes total strangers, test drive their personal vehicles). There are a lot of people who just want a Tesla. They're not shopping around to find the best car. Offering a refund means those people can buy with confidence, knowing they can return it if it's not all they expected.

hnmonkey 8y ago
Where are you getting that people who own a Tesla sometimes are very generous and let strangers test drive their cars? I can't imagine a scenario where anyone would go for that given how expensive they are and how that kind of thing just doesn't happen with cars in general.
- cbhl 8y ago
  If I recall correctly, the SF Bay Area has quite a few Teslas on Getaround...
- Zanni 8y ago
  Personal experience. Tesla owners tend to be so stoked on their cars that they want to share the experience. Seriously. I've seen multiple requests and offers on Tesla forums and apparently it's pretty common at Tesla meet-ups as well.
  - hnmonkey 8y ago
    That is wild. I've never heard of anything like that before with cars.
- londons_explore 8y ago
  This varies by country. In Europe, cars are pretty personal items, and typically only insured for one or a few drivers. Lending your car to a friend for a day would typically involve hours on the phone to the insurance company and a few hundred euros of fees. There are apps (cuvva) which try to reduce this, but even so it'll probably be cheaper and less effort to call an Uber rather than borrow a friend's car. In the USA, loaning a car to a friend or neighbor seems far more common.

atwebb 8y ago

Wait for "brand ambassadors", gig economy for test drives.

goshx 8y ago

I am not sure if I understood what you meant, but they are not implying that you should buy first and then drive. The policy is about giving more time to return the car if the customer didn't do a test drive before. At Model 3's early days, a lot of people bought the car without having the option to take one out for a test drive.

gpmcadam 8y ago

Wish they'd just let you rent cars instead. A test drive is too short. And a 7 day period is too big a commitment. Why not let me pay to rent a car, like a normal rental car place, and pay per day. Would be cool to do anyway, but I bet a lot of people would end up falling in love with the car that way and become owners shortly after.

sliken 8y ago
I used (but am not affiliated with) Turo.com to rent a model S for 2 days.
derekp7 8y ago
That is exactly how I ended up deciding on my current car. When my old vehicle was in for service, I drove the car I was considering purchasing as a rental for 3 days and really fell in love with all aspects of it (in my case a Fusion).

sliken 8y ago

Dunno. I hate test drives, WAY too short to really learn much beyond a general idea of performance and how comfortable the seats are. Buying a new car for $$$ (I keep them for at least 10 years, currently 14) is a pretty big commitment for a 10-20 minute test drive. Imagine getting married after a 20 minute date. I rented a model S for 2 days, I was still learning things about it when I returned it.

paranoidrobot 8y ago
I guess Tesla is different, but many dealers will let you take the car for a day or two for a longer test drive if you're serious about buying the car from them. eg to make sure the car fits in you garage, it's convenient for picking up the kids, etc.
- sliken 8y ago
  So far I bought a Acura Integra GSR, Subaru WRX, and Subaru Forester XT. It required some cajoling to get even a short test drive, even when buying a second car from the same dealer. All 3 cars were pretty hot at the time, all 3 won car of the year or similar awards in the year I got them. I suspect if cars are in demand (and don't spend many days on the dealer lot) they minimize the test drives. If they spend months on the lot they are more generous with the test drives.

7e 8y ago

This means that when you buy online, it's possible you'll be delivered someone else's 1,000 mile return. There's a reason Tesla delays titling their cars; that allows them to resell returns as new.

eeeeeeeeeeeee 8y ago
I was wondering the same thing. Where do all these returns go?

Daviey 8y ago

I organised a test drive, with no intention of buying the car. It was just as an "experience" day for the family.... I enjoyed it so much, I then bought a Model S. I wouldn't have bought without the test drive.