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Quick Review (WARNING: contains controversial opinions!) Good: - "minimal usable set of keywords and control structures" - "simple cooperation with C" - "no

Quick Review (WARNING: contains controversial opinions!) Good: - "minimal usable set of keywords and control structures" - "simple cooperation with C" - "no access to files on physical drive" - reasonably terse syntax (except for "end instead of braces") Bad: - The name of the language, I don't know how to pronounce it and I can't remember how to type it. Rename to "Boa" or similar. - The name of the author, it's a bad transliteration. Rename to "Christoph Shoechuck" or similar. - "focus on targeting UNIX-like operating system" - "intended to be used with shell scripts" - shell scripts are brittle and awful to write - end instead of braces What: - isn't AOT and JIT contradictory? - isn't interfacing with C and "no access to files" contradictory? Conclusion: I like a simple, small and embeddable language, but I don't want to embed anything in shell scripts and I don't want to depend on UNIX.

palaiologos 8y ago
I've made a mistake while creating thread and I think I'm no longer able to edit the title. I'm from Poland, so such name is natural for us. Euboea depends on POSIX and X86 highly, therefore I thought about Euboea like about another text processing / computation language to be used in shell scripts making programming easier. > isn't interfacing with C and "no access to files" contradictory As UNIX philosophy states, CLI tools may use stdin and stdout (among other streams), to read data, process it, and output it back. Also, this model is ensuring a) safety, b) simplicity. Interfacing with C is actually not that advanced right now and all you can do is to specify C function name by modifying libE.c, it's exported name usable from Euboea and amount of parameters (-1 if vararg)
- zeroname 8y ago
  > I'm from Poland, so such name is natural for us. I'm aware, but your global audience is generally not. That's why I advise on name changes. You own your name, you can do anything to it. There are people from India with names so long that a byte overflows and there are people from Africa with exclamation marks (click sounds) in their names. I'm sure there's a great cultural heritage behind these names, but they're just impractical. If I don't know how to pronounce a name, I am going to avoid you just a little bit more. I'm less likely to remember your name. I'll have to look it up to spell it right. Should I get into the unfortunate situation of having to pronounce it in public, I'm likely to embarrass myself. In short, your name is a risk to me. A small risk, all things considered, but a risk nonetheless. It's causing me extra work. A small amount of extra work, but extra work nonetheless. The thing is, it's not just me, it's almost everyone, even those who wouldn't dare admit it or those who are unconscious of it. All those tiny little negatives add up to a significant negative in your life. Studies show that "foreign-sounding" names lead to less job interviews, for instance, but it doesn't end there. Of course, if you hate success (as is common in Poland) you might not be bothered by all of that. Sour grapes, but fair. > Euboea depends on POSIX and X86 highly, therefore I thought about Euboea like about another text processing / computation language to be used in shell scripts making programming easier. If that's the focus, your selling point should be something along these lines of "a simple programming language to create UNIX tools", because that's really what distinguishes it. I also think you can then give up on the whole "safety" aspect, because UNIX fundamentally is unsafe and "no access to files" becomes a limitation, not a feature.
  - lucozade 8y ago
    > That's why I advise on name changes What astonishing presumption > Of course, if you hate success (as is common in Poland) Is the casual racism completely necessary? Couldn't you just stick to the critique of the work rather than the person and his nationality?
    - zeroname 8y ago
      > What astonishing presumption There's tons of evidence: https://www.newyorker.com/tech/annals-of-technology/why-your-name-matters https://www.newyorker.com/tech/annals-of-technology/why-your... If it's "presumptious" of me to point that out, I don't care. Only ever telling people what they want to hear is not helpful. > Is the casual racism completely necessary? Is the casual accusation of racism completely necessary? It has nothing to do with race, more with history. Crab mentality is very common in the former "eastern block". > Couldn't you just stick to the critique of the work rather than the person and his nationality? I'm not criticizing the person's nationality, that's not their choice. I'm drawing the distinction between the individual and their nationality. You can be a proud Pole, doing polish things, espousing polish ideals and mannerisms above all else, whatever. You also can be an individual in global society who happens to be from Poland.
      - lucozade 8y ago
        You don’t need to cite the prevalence of racist bigotry. Most people are aware. Practising it is fucking despicable.
        zeroname 8y ago
        > You don’t need to cite the prevalence of racist bigotry. Most people are aware. If you think discriminating based on difficult names is "racist bigotry", okay. It doesn't change the facts. If you want free discrimination showered upon you, keep your unpronouncable foreign name. If you want success, change it. It is common practice for a reason. > Practising it is fucking despicable. You know what's despicable? Accusing people of "being racist" for just acting like ordinary people happen to act. It's diminishing the impact of the word. Ordinary people, including you, do have these biases. Consciously, unconsciously, it doesn't matter. I want people to do better for themselves, I can't change the world for them. Neither can you by leaving these comments on HN.

palaiologos 8y ago

I've made a mistake while creating thread and I think I'm no longer able to edit the title. I'm from Poland, so such name is natural for us. Euboea depends on POSIX and X86 highly, therefore I thought about Euboea like about another text processing / computation language to be used in shell scripts making programming easier. > isn't interfacing with C and "no access to files" contradictory As UNIX philosophy states, CLI tools may use stdin and stdout (among other streams), to read data, process it, and output it back. Also, this model is ensuring a) safety, b) simplicity. Interfacing with C is actually not that advanced right now and all you can do is to specify C function name by modifying libE.c, it's exported name usable from Euboea and amount of parameters (-1 if vararg)

zeroname 8y ago
> I'm from Poland, so such name is natural for us. I'm aware, but your global audience is generally not. That's why I advise on name changes. You own your name, you can do anything to it. There are people from India with names so long that a byte overflows and there are people from Africa with exclamation marks (click sounds) in their names. I'm sure there's a great cultural heritage behind these names, but they're just impractical. If I don't know how to pronounce a name, I am going to avoid you just a little bit more. I'm less likely to remember your name. I'll have to look it up to spell it right. Should I get into the unfortunate situation of having to pronounce it in public, I'm likely to embarrass myself. In short, your name is a risk to me. A small risk, all things considered, but a risk nonetheless. It's causing me extra work. A small amount of extra work, but extra work nonetheless. The thing is, it's not just me, it's almost everyone, even those who wouldn't dare admit it or those who are unconscious of it. All those tiny little negatives add up to a significant negative in your life. Studies show that "foreign-sounding" names lead to less job interviews, for instance, but it doesn't end there. Of course, if you hate success (as is common in Poland) you might not be bothered by all of that. Sour grapes, but fair. > Euboea depends on POSIX and X86 highly, therefore I thought about Euboea like about another text processing / computation language to be used in shell scripts making programming easier. If that's the focus, your selling point should be something along these lines of "a simple programming language to create UNIX tools", because that's really what distinguishes it. I also think you can then give up on the whole "safety" aspect, because UNIX fundamentally is unsafe and "no access to files" becomes a limitation, not a feature.
- lucozade 8y ago
  > That's why I advise on name changes What astonishing presumption > Of course, if you hate success (as is common in Poland) Is the casual racism completely necessary? Couldn't you just stick to the critique of the work rather than the person and his nationality?
  - zeroname 8y ago
    > What astonishing presumption There's tons of evidence: https://www.newyorker.com/tech/annals-of-technology/why-your-name-matters https://www.newyorker.com/tech/annals-of-technology/why-your... If it's "presumptious" of me to point that out, I don't care. Only ever telling people what they want to hear is not helpful. > Is the casual racism completely necessary? Is the casual accusation of racism completely necessary? It has nothing to do with race, more with history. Crab mentality is very common in the former "eastern block". > Couldn't you just stick to the critique of the work rather than the person and his nationality? I'm not criticizing the person's nationality, that's not their choice. I'm drawing the distinction between the individual and their nationality. You can be a proud Pole, doing polish things, espousing polish ideals and mannerisms above all else, whatever. You also can be an individual in global society who happens to be from Poland.
    - lucozade 8y ago
      You don’t need to cite the prevalence of racist bigotry. Most people are aware. Practising it is fucking despicable.
      - zeroname 8y ago
        > You don’t need to cite the prevalence of racist bigotry. Most people are aware. If you think discriminating based on difficult names is "racist bigotry", okay. It doesn't change the facts. If you want free discrimination showered upon you, keep your unpronouncable foreign name. If you want success, change it. It is common practice for a reason. > Practising it is fucking despicable. You know what's despicable? Accusing people of "being racist" for just acting like ordinary people happen to act. It's diminishing the impact of the word. Ordinary people, including you, do have these biases. Consciously, unconsciously, it doesn't matter. I want people to do better for themselves, I can't change the world for them. Neither can you by leaving these comments on HN.