4 ms·

Judges 'giving up' trying to stop juries using Internet

6 points by AlexMuir 16y ago

jaysonelliot 16y ago
I've always worried about the concept of jury trials anyway, to be honest. Why would I prefer my fate to be decided by twelve random bozos off the street, when there's a judge right there who is actually educated in the law, and presumably bases their reputation on their capability to judge people fairly?
- badwetter 16y ago
  Depends on a case by case basis. I think in some cases one might actually want a jury trial. Still there isn't many people being tried by a jury of their peers anymore, if you know what I mean.
- jrockway 16y ago
  In the US, you can request a bench trial instead of a jury trial (at least according to Wikipedia; I have not heard of anyone doing this).
- abalashov 16y ago
  I'm sorry, but your ignorance of actual criminal case outcomes shows here; in almost every conceivable situation, juries return a verdict more favourable to the defendant than judges do. Requesting a jury trial is rule #0 of any criminal defense attorney's playbook. Even a little http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury_nullification http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury_nullification is not unheard of.
- tzs 16y ago
  If there were no facts in dispute, and so all that we needed was for someone to say what the law says the outcome is given the set of facts, then a judge would be all you would need. Heck, you could skip the judge and just have law students handle it. The problem is that usually there are facts in dispute. Someone has to listen to witnesses telling conflicting stories, and decide which are telling the truth and which are not. That's what the jury is for.
- ungtss 16y ago
  i'm a defense attorney -- in my opinion, judges have a better grasp on the law because of their training, but juries have a much better grasp of the real world. judges have been insulated from the typical criminal case lifestyle and demographic -- they tend to come from wealthy, stable, upper middle class backgrounds. they don't know how things are on the streets trailer parks, and ghettos, and they don't know why people lie, and the shenanigans people pull. they tend to base their decisions on the theory they know well, rather than the street smarts they lack. i always go with a jury, except with cases like child porn. In CP cases, the jury is much more likely to get emotionally fired up and send your guy to the gallows, because probably half of them have been molested or know somebody who has. judges are again insulated from this, and they'll tend to look at it as a "mere possession" case, and go easier on you.
badwetter 16y ago
Most of the media rules regarding trials etc., need to be rethought. Same as many laws in my opinion. Laws need to be constanly updated now that our societies move at a faster pace in terms of innovation.
frou_dh 16y ago
I've attended a few conferences lately, which have been the first "lecture"-like settings I've been in since graduating in 2007. The extent to which fellow attendees felt the need to constantly mess around on laptops and smartphones during presentations was dismaying and struck me as rather disrespectful. The conference organisers even seemed to encourage this by bleating on about twitter hashtags whenever they got the chance, and having live twitter searches full of vacuous banter distractingly projected as a peer to the presenter's slides. Honestly, I thought I had a problem with attention deficit, but maybe I ain't seen nothing yet.

6 points by AlexMuir 16y ago

I've always worried about the concept of jury trials anyway, to be honest. Why would I prefer my fate to be decided by twelve random bozos off the street, when there's a judge right there who is actually educated in the law, and presumably bases their reputation on their capability to judge people fairly?

badwetter 16y ago
Depends on a case by case basis. I think in some cases one might actually want a jury trial. Still there isn't many people being tried by a jury of their peers anymore, if you know what I mean.
jrockway 16y ago
In the US, you can request a bench trial instead of a jury trial (at least according to Wikipedia; I have not heard of anyone doing this).
abalashov 16y ago
I'm sorry, but your ignorance of actual criminal case outcomes shows here; in almost every conceivable situation, juries return a verdict more favourable to the defendant than judges do. Requesting a jury trial is rule #0 of any criminal defense attorney's playbook. Even a little http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury_nullification http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury_nullification is not unheard of.
tzs 16y ago
If there were no facts in dispute, and so all that we needed was for someone to say what the law says the outcome is given the set of facts, then a judge would be all you would need. Heck, you could skip the judge and just have law students handle it. The problem is that usually there are facts in dispute. Someone has to listen to witnesses telling conflicting stories, and decide which are telling the truth and which are not. That's what the jury is for.
ungtss 16y ago
i'm a defense attorney -- in my opinion, judges have a better grasp on the law because of their training, but juries have a much better grasp of the real world. judges have been insulated from the typical criminal case lifestyle and demographic -- they tend to come from wealthy, stable, upper middle class backgrounds. they don't know how things are on the streets trailer parks, and ghettos, and they don't know why people lie, and the shenanigans people pull. they tend to base their decisions on the theory they know well, rather than the street smarts they lack. i always go with a jury, except with cases like child porn. In CP cases, the jury is much more likely to get emotionally fired up and send your guy to the gallows, because probably half of them have been molested or know somebody who has. judges are again insulated from this, and they'll tend to look at it as a "mere possession" case, and go easier on you.

badwetter 16y ago

Most of the media rules regarding trials etc., need to be rethought. Same as many laws in my opinion. Laws need to be constanly updated now that our societies move at a faster pace in terms of innovation.

frou_dh 16y ago

I've attended a few conferences lately, which have been the first "lecture"-like settings I've been in since graduating in 2007. The extent to which fellow attendees felt the need to constantly mess around on laptops and smartphones during presentations was dismaying and struck me as rather disrespectful. The conference organisers even seemed to encourage this by bleating on about twitter hashtags whenever they got the chance, and having live twitter searches full of vacuous banter distractingly projected as a peer to the presenter's slides. Honestly, I thought I had a problem with attention deficit, but maybe I ain't seen nothing yet.