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No and no. Math equations are abstract concepts within the mind. This question is about how the mind exists in the first place. Nothing here even remotely impli

No and no. Math equations are abstract concepts within the mind. This question is about how the mind exists in the first place. Nothing here even remotely implies that math equations are conscious.

phkahler 8y ago
Does the Mandelbrot set exist? We have a mathematical description of it. It's easy to write software to create pictures "of it". Mandelbrot himself wrote software to create an image of it based on his definition - prior to knowing what it looked like. Indeed, he was surprised at the complexity of what he saw. Did that set of points exist prior to a human stumbling on its definition? Does it exist independent of someone rendering an image of it? I would argue that it does exist - and always has - in some form.
- gotocake 8y ago
  This is effectively Max Tegemark’s TOE, the Mathematical Universe Hypothesis. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mathematical_universe_hypothesis https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mathematical_universe_hypoth... Tegmark's MUH is: Our external physical reality is a mathematical structure.[3] That is, the physical universe is not merely described by mathematics, but is mathematics (specifically, a mathematical structure). Mathematical existence equals physical existence, and all structures that exist mathematically exist physically as well. Observers, including humans, are "self-aware substructures (SASs)". In any mathematical structure complex enough to contain such substructures, they "will subjectively perceive themselves as existing in a physically 'real' world".[4]
  - phkahler 8y ago
    Well said. In my previous comment I deleted a paragraph where I wrote something like: If there exists a mathematical model/definition of our universe - weather that has been discovered by humans or not - that is sufficient to ensure that it exists. While I have read of the "existence" of mathematical objects I was not aware of anyone writing that we live in such a thing - I figured it must be out there somewhere. Thanks for the link and providing a name for the concept.

No and no. Math equations are abstract concepts within the mind. This question is about how the mind exists in the first place. Nothing here even remotely implies that math equations are conscious.

phkahler 8y ago

Does the Mandelbrot set exist? We have a mathematical description of it. It's easy to write software to create pictures "of it". Mandelbrot himself wrote software to create an image of it based on his definition - prior to knowing what it looked like. Indeed, he was surprised at the complexity of what he saw. Did that set of points exist prior to a human stumbling on its definition? Does it exist independent of someone rendering an image of it? I would argue that it does exist - and always has - in some form.

gotocake 8y ago
This is effectively Max Tegemark’s TOE, the Mathematical Universe Hypothesis. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mathematical_universe_hypothesis https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mathematical_universe_hypoth... Tegmark's MUH is: Our external physical reality is a mathematical structure.[3] That is, the physical universe is not merely described by mathematics, but is mathematics (specifically, a mathematical structure). Mathematical existence equals physical existence, and all structures that exist mathematically exist physically as well. Observers, including humans, are "self-aware substructures (SASs)". In any mathematical structure complex enough to contain such substructures, they "will subjectively perceive themselves as existing in a physically 'real' world".[4]
- phkahler 8y ago
  Well said. In my previous comment I deleted a paragraph where I wrote something like: If there exists a mathematical model/definition of our universe - weather that has been discovered by humans or not - that is sufficient to ensure that it exists. While I have read of the "existence" of mathematical objects I was not aware of anyone writing that we live in such a thing - I figured it must be out there somewhere. Thanks for the link and providing a name for the concept.