4 ms·

My entire career has been startups. On average, your startup will be a failure. If you want to create one, then it should be for an idea that you really believ

My entire career has been startups. On average, your startup will be a failure. If you want to create one, then it should be for an idea that you really believe in and that has value. Because you're going to have bad days--lots of them--and want to quit. And if you don't believe in what you're building, then you will quit, and it'll all be for nothing. (Plus, if you believe in what you're building and it fails, you won't regret it later.. you'll at least appreciate what you learned.) The fact that you're asking at all, tells me you should probably stay at your job. If I (a random 3rd party) needs to convince you to do a startup, then forget it. The idea must not be very compelling--it certainly isn't to you. And if you're thinking that is the path because you've read a bunch of success porn.. you're in for a rude awakening.

sujesh 8y ago
Yep money comes second , product validation and market fit comes first
- taneq 8y ago
  Well, there's two types of money, aren't there? "Real" money comes after product development, market fit testing, market penetration, iteration, supporting early adopters, building market presence, etc. "Virtual" money comes after product sketching, roadmapping, pitching to VCs, and cashing out (ideally before the 'market fit testing' stage.) Edit: Oof, unpopular opinion apparently.
  - akuji1993 8y ago
    The issue is, that if you want to create a startup because you want to get rich from it, it's the wrong attitude all together and will probably fail. Your concern shouldn't be how to get rich quick, but how to build a viable product that solves a real issue. If you get that done, the money will come.
  - mikekchar 8y ago
    Ha ha! I've sometimes joked that when you start a startup you have to decide who the "customer" is -- the person using the service or the VC. I've definitely worked at startups that were milking VCs. I don't really recommend it as a thing for technically minded people to do because you end up doing a lot of crazy stuff that has nothing to do with making a good product. But it definitely happens.
    - taneq 8y ago
      Precisely.
yaseer 8y ago
This. The probability is that your startup will fail. However, you would not have failed as an individual if you're passionate about what you're building, and enjoyed building it, whatever the eventual outcome.
- tfehring 8y ago
  Correction: You will not have made the wrong decision if you enjoyed the experience enough to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for it.
8f2ab37a-ed6c 8y ago
This, pick something you really care about and would be willing to eat and breathe for a long, long time, because if you succeed at it, you're going to be doing it for a while. Don't aim for the Instagram style "exit for 1B in two years", if that's the goal the go to Vegas, it will save you a lot of time and tears. If you don't, and if you're luckier than most, you might get stuck working on an idea or in an industry you really don't care about, just because you wanted to play startup and, like the poster above said, you read up on a bunch of success porn that's telling you that startups are the sexy, right thing for you. Then you'll be stuck between a rock and a hard place, hating what you do for years, but not being able to leave because of all of the sunk cost, the shame of abandoning the team of people you've brought on board and convinced to chase a dream you don't really care about yourself, the reputation hit, the VCs who sunk all that cash into you, and the carrot of a potential, however tiny exit dangling in front of you. And the years keep adding up as you're chasing that carrot, still dreaming every day of getting out, but somehow that exit just never happens. If you're lucky/smart you'll find someone to replace you, but then they might kill the golden goose and you're still left with nothing, but at least you moved on, so that's a silver lining. Fall in love with the problem and with the mission, that way, even if you fail or have a pretty rough time, at least you're working on something that truly matters to you. And "doing a startup" can't be the mission in itself, that's a recipe for disaster. It's one of those situations where even if you win, you still lose.
primitivesuave 8y ago
Second this. You might not even fail outright but rather realize you've worked every hour of every day for years for an average gain of a couple dollars an hour. You can do it if the environment is right for you to thrive (i.e. build something of great value) and you can tolerate the risks involved.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
tzhenghao 8y ago
This too. I've worked for startups a few years now, and as many HN commenters here have said, you WILL have many bad days. You'll see crazy shit once in a while, so it's almost always easier to answer your question by starting with why NOT to join a startup. Justin Kan has a good writeup on this: https://www.atrium.co/blog/work-at-a-startup/ https://www.atrium.co/blog/work-at-a-startup/ Read it, and then read it a second time. On your second pass, put more thought on the "what if the startup fails", as one tends to overestimate the upside (riches etc.) without weighing out the downside of the risks involved. Unless you feel "yes, this is what I sign up for" very strongly, you probably shouldn't. Just to wrap this point up, here's why I'm where I'm at. I've "roughly" figured out something I can live with in my career. Working in a big company with big bureaucracy, slow processes and being told to do something insignificant kills me, and I'm better off working at startups and hopefully start something my own later on, despite the potential downsides.
fatnoah 8y ago
Building on this. I've been deeply involved (4+ years at each) in three startups. Two where acquired and one is still going profitable. I wore a lot of hats and learned an amazing amount of stuff at all of them. Despite my lucky track record, the main financial benefit I got was being acquired while I was an executive of one startup. My 1% stake was worthless, but the retention cash and RSUs I got from the acquiring company weren't insignificant. Most people got a much smaller amount of cash and RSUs were on par with any other employee of the company. If you want to learn, grow, and be a big fish in a small pond, go for a startup. It's fun, frenetic, stressful at times, and you can have as big an impact as you want. If you have dreams of $$$, stay at a public company that can shower you with cash and RSUs.

sujesh 8y ago

Yep money comes second , product validation and market fit comes first

taneq 8y ago
Well, there's two types of money, aren't there? "Real" money comes after product development, market fit testing, market penetration, iteration, supporting early adopters, building market presence, etc. "Virtual" money comes after product sketching, roadmapping, pitching to VCs, and cashing out (ideally before the 'market fit testing' stage.) Edit: Oof, unpopular opinion apparently.
- akuji1993 8y ago
  The issue is, that if you want to create a startup because you want to get rich from it, it's the wrong attitude all together and will probably fail. Your concern shouldn't be how to get rich quick, but how to build a viable product that solves a real issue. If you get that done, the money will come.
- mikekchar 8y ago
  Ha ha! I've sometimes joked that when you start a startup you have to decide who the "customer" is -- the person using the service or the VC. I've definitely worked at startups that were milking VCs. I don't really recommend it as a thing for technically minded people to do because you end up doing a lot of crazy stuff that has nothing to do with making a good product. But it definitely happens.
  - taneq 8y ago
    Precisely.

yaseer 8y ago

This. The probability is that your startup will fail. However, you would not have failed as an individual if you're passionate about what you're building, and enjoyed building it, whatever the eventual outcome.

tfehring 8y ago
Correction: You will not have made the wrong decision if you enjoyed the experience enough to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for it.

8f2ab37a-ed6c 8y ago

This, pick something you really care about and would be willing to eat and breathe for a long, long time, because if you succeed at it, you're going to be doing it for a while. Don't aim for the Instagram style "exit for 1B in two years", if that's the goal the go to Vegas, it will save you a lot of time and tears. If you don't, and if you're luckier than most, you might get stuck working on an idea or in an industry you really don't care about, just because you wanted to play startup and, like the poster above said, you read up on a bunch of success porn that's telling you that startups are the sexy, right thing for you. Then you'll be stuck between a rock and a hard place, hating what you do for years, but not being able to leave because of all of the sunk cost, the shame of abandoning the team of people you've brought on board and convinced to chase a dream you don't really care about yourself, the reputation hit, the VCs who sunk all that cash into you, and the carrot of a potential, however tiny exit dangling in front of you. And the years keep adding up as you're chasing that carrot, still dreaming every day of getting out, but somehow that exit just never happens. If you're lucky/smart you'll find someone to replace you, but then they might kill the golden goose and you're still left with nothing, but at least you moved on, so that's a silver lining. Fall in love with the problem and with the mission, that way, even if you fail or have a pretty rough time, at least you're working on something that truly matters to you. And "doing a startup" can't be the mission in itself, that's a recipe for disaster. It's one of those situations where even if you win, you still lose.

primitivesuave 8y ago

Second this. You might not even fail outright but rather realize you've worked every hour of every day for years for an average gain of a couple dollars an hour. You can do it if the environment is right for you to thrive (i.e. build something of great value) and you can tolerate the risks involved.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

tzhenghao 8y ago

This too. I've worked for startups a few years now, and as many HN commenters here have said, you WILL have many bad days. You'll see crazy shit once in a while, so it's almost always easier to answer your question by starting with why NOT to join a startup. Justin Kan has a good writeup on this: https://www.atrium.co/blog/work-at-a-startup/ https://www.atrium.co/blog/work-at-a-startup/ Read it, and then read it a second time. On your second pass, put more thought on the "what if the startup fails", as one tends to overestimate the upside (riches etc.) without weighing out the downside of the risks involved. Unless you feel "yes, this is what I sign up for" very strongly, you probably shouldn't. Just to wrap this point up, here's why I'm where I'm at. I've "roughly" figured out something I can live with in my career. Working in a big company with big bureaucracy, slow processes and being told to do something insignificant kills me, and I'm better off working at startups and hopefully start something my own later on, despite the potential downsides.

fatnoah 8y ago

Building on this. I've been deeply involved (4+ years at each) in three startups. Two where acquired and one is still going profitable. I wore a lot of hats and learned an amazing amount of stuff at all of them. Despite my lucky track record, the main financial benefit I got was being acquired while I was an executive of one startup. My 1% stake was worthless, but the retention cash and RSUs I got from the acquiring company weren't insignificant. Most people got a much smaller amount of cash and RSUs were on par with any other employee of the company. If you want to learn, grow, and be a big fish in a small pond, go for a startup. It's fun, frenetic, stressful at times, and you can have as big an impact as you want. If you have dreams of $$$, stay at a public company that can shower you with cash and RSUs.