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I disagreed with the central thesis, that dystopia necessarily arises from utopian visions. There are lots of dystopian settings throughout the last century tha

by n4r9 8y ago

I disagreed with the central thesis, that dystopia necessarily arises from utopian visions. There are lots of dystopian settings throughout the last century that defy this - 1984, waterworld and mad max to name a few. For the author to go on to use this invented meaning as a counterargument to Trump's America being dystopian is disingenuous at best. I wouldn't call it a dystopia myself, but I'd hope to have better grounds for that than inventing meanings.

_bxg1 8y ago
I don't think it was disingenuous because of the fact that he's clearly not a Trump fan himself. But, I do think it's a pretty minor semantic distinction to make. As for the distinction itself, I was prompted to look it up on Merriam-Webster: dys· to· pia | \ (ˌ)dis-ˈtō-pē-ə \ Definition of dystopia 1 : an imagined world or society in which people lead wretched, dehumanized, fearful lives 2 : ANTI-UTOPIA sense 2 So... the primary definition actually undercuts his thesis, while the second definition lines up. I mean it's an interesting subject of contemplation - dystopia's relationship with utopia - but he took an argumentative approach rather than a contemplative one, which I think squandered the topic a little.
75dvtwin 8y ago
Well, I think, that a second central topic of the article is the 'naming calling'. That is, using labels that previously widely used defined patterns resulting in real human-killing -- to, instead, describe a pattern that a person finds unfitting to his/her policy views. In other words, misplaced naming calling, in a way, stealing the valor from the real victims of the true dystopian past events. "... It is important to keep dystopia in its place, and in perspective. There are and have been real dystopias in the world, and imaginary ones help illustrate how utopian visions can endanger decent regimes and communities. Not every call for a border wall or “Medicare for all” is dystopian; one (or the other) may be a stupid idea, but it is not summoning 1984. ..."

by n4r9 8y ago

_bxg1 8y ago

I don't think it was disingenuous because of the fact that he's clearly not a Trump fan himself. But, I do think it's a pretty minor semantic distinction to make. As for the distinction itself, I was prompted to look it up on Merriam-Webster: dys· to· pia | \ (ˌ)dis-ˈtō-pē-ə \ Definition of dystopia 1 : an imagined world or society in which people lead wretched, dehumanized, fearful lives 2 : ANTI-UTOPIA sense 2 So... the primary definition actually undercuts his thesis, while the second definition lines up. I mean it's an interesting subject of contemplation - dystopia's relationship with utopia - but he took an argumentative approach rather than a contemplative one, which I think squandered the topic a little.

75dvtwin 8y ago

Well, I think, that a second central topic of the article is the 'naming calling'. That is, using labels that previously widely used defined patterns resulting in real human-killing -- to, instead, describe a pattern that a person finds unfitting to his/her policy views. In other words, misplaced naming calling, in a way, stealing the valor from the real victims of the true dystopian past events. "... It is important to keep dystopia in its place, and in perspective. There are and have been real dystopias in the world, and imaginary ones help illustrate how utopian visions can endanger decent regimes and communities. Not every call for a border wall or “Medicare for all” is dystopian; one (or the other) may be a stupid idea, but it is not summoning 1984. ..."