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This story is becoming too familiar. The extent to which our freedom of speech is being limited today is frightening. It's clear to me that universities are no

This story is becoming too familiar. The extent to which our freedom of speech is being limited today is frightening. It's clear to me that universities are no longer a place for intellectuals and free-thinkers to question the rationality of society. People are being fired for writing emotional tweets. Are we that sensitive, scared, and close-minded? Is this sustainable?

paulrd 8y ago
This reminds me of Chomsky's critiques of universities' treatment of anti-war and anti Israeli scholarship. I recall him particularly defending Norman Finkelstein: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Finkelstein#Tenure_denial_and_resignation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Finkelstein#Tenure_deni...
stronglikedan 8y ago
> our freedom of speech is being limited We have the same freedom of speech that we've always had. > Are we that sensitive, scared, and close-minded? The online community seems to be. Good thing it's just a very vocal minority. > Is this sustainable? Online: yes. IRL: it wouldn't be, but that's why it doesn't spill out into real life that often, and when it does, it's discouraged.
- colpabar 8y ago
  > Good thing it's just a vocal minority. Are you being sarcastic? The "very vocal minority" has seemingly limitless power to ruin people's lives over words they don't like. Businesses are forced to close, professors are forced to resign. We're passed the point of being able to say "it's just the internet," and it's time we all acknowledged that.
  - Pharmakon 8y ago
    The four highest officials in Virginia just brazened out being in blackface, Steve King still has a job, and the president is... well I won’t go into it. I think you might need to recalibrate your sense of these things.
    - colpabar 8y ago
      It's interesting that you only mentioned politicians and not any of the businesses or professors who have been ruined, like I said in my comment. When an internet mob comes for a politician, a political mob fights back. Most people don't have that luxury.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
- billbrown 8y ago
  Yes, there is still a First Amendment and its protections are still quite robust. But the same culture of freedom of speech that "we've always had?" Decidedly not. And without that culture, the First Amendment will wither and become eviscerated over time.
- jorgesborges 8y ago
  Our freedom of speech is limited in the sense that its expression carries a greater risk. If people are apprehensive about sharing a frank opinion, if the risk is losing a career or family, the corollary is fewer opinions being shared and a smaller social discourse.
bitexploder 8y ago
Society was never rational. I like to think Universities are a place to explore ideas that improve society and connect like-minded human beings. They exist to enhance our understanding of ... everything, including society :)
- cheesymuffin 8y ago
  That'll be $200,000
  - bitexploder 8y ago
    Yeah... the ideal purpose of universities and the way they have grown almost tumor like administrative arms, which seem to only take resources and not advance anything meaningful is sad.
Nasrudith 8y ago
Society has always had their stupid taboos. People were being arrested for saying "fuck" and obscenity laws are a clear rationalization of Common Law norms in naked defiance of the plain text of the first ammendment. It isn't a legal issue now so much as a social issue. Even if there were strong employment protection laws enforcibility would make it difficult to prove. Such stupidity is unfortunately sustainable even though it is far from wise. Unfortunately good management and sense is often fragile despite being ideal.

paulrd 8y ago

This reminds me of Chomsky's critiques of universities' treatment of anti-war and anti Israeli scholarship. I recall him particularly defending Norman Finkelstein: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Finkelstein#Tenure_denial_and_resignation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Finkelstein#Tenure_deni...

stronglikedan 8y ago

> our freedom of speech is being limited We have the same freedom of speech that we've always had. > Are we that sensitive, scared, and close-minded? The online community seems to be. Good thing it's just a very vocal minority. > Is this sustainable? Online: yes. IRL: it wouldn't be, but that's why it doesn't spill out into real life that often, and when it does, it's discouraged.

colpabar 8y ago
> Good thing it's just a vocal minority. Are you being sarcastic? The "very vocal minority" has seemingly limitless power to ruin people's lives over words they don't like. Businesses are forced to close, professors are forced to resign. We're passed the point of being able to say "it's just the internet," and it's time we all acknowledged that.
- Pharmakon 8y ago
  The four highest officials in Virginia just brazened out being in blackface, Steve King still has a job, and the president is... well I won’t go into it. I think you might need to recalibrate your sense of these things.
  - colpabar 8y ago
    It's interesting that you only mentioned politicians and not any of the businesses or professors who have been ruined, like I said in my comment. When an internet mob comes for a politician, a political mob fights back. Most people don't have that luxury.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
billbrown 8y ago
Yes, there is still a First Amendment and its protections are still quite robust. But the same culture of freedom of speech that "we've always had?" Decidedly not. And without that culture, the First Amendment will wither and become eviscerated over time.
jorgesborges 8y ago
Our freedom of speech is limited in the sense that its expression carries a greater risk. If people are apprehensive about sharing a frank opinion, if the risk is losing a career or family, the corollary is fewer opinions being shared and a smaller social discourse.

bitexploder 8y ago

Society was never rational. I like to think Universities are a place to explore ideas that improve society and connect like-minded human beings. They exist to enhance our understanding of ... everything, including society :)

cheesymuffin 8y ago
That'll be $200,000
- bitexploder 8y ago
  Yeah... the ideal purpose of universities and the way they have grown almost tumor like administrative arms, which seem to only take resources and not advance anything meaningful is sad.

Nasrudith 8y ago

Society has always had their stupid taboos. People were being arrested for saying "fuck" and obscenity laws are a clear rationalization of Common Law norms in naked defiance of the plain text of the first ammendment. It isn't a legal issue now so much as a social issue. Even if there were strong employment protection laws enforcibility would make it difficult to prove. Such stupidity is unfortunately sustainable even though it is far from wise. Unfortunately good management and sense is often fragile despite being ideal.