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Imagine if Apple and Google made full frame cameras. Currently we have great hardware with terrible software and vice-versa. A Sony full frame sensor, Zeiss

Imagine if Apple and Google made full frame cameras. Currently we have great hardware with terrible software and vice-versa. A Sony full frame sensor, Zeiss glass, with an A series chip and good software to make it shine.

dpwm 8y ago
> Imagine if Apple and Google made full frame cameras. I did – briefly – and am still recoiling from the horror. > Currently we have great hardware with terrible software and vice-versa. The software on even older DSLRs isn't terrible. It does the job it was intended to do quite well. It is learn-able, and it doesn't change its behaviour with an OTA-update you can't easily prevent. More thought has gone into the UI design of even the earliest, rushed-to-market DSLR firmwares than some of the UI changes that Apple and Google have inflicted on their victims.
- tambourine_man 8y ago
  > I did – briefly – and am still recoiling from the horror. Please explain. > The software on even older DSLRs isn't terrible. Oh yes it is. Like salt on a fresh wound. > It does the job it was intended to do quite well. It is learn-able, and it doesn't change its behaviour with an OTA-update you can't easily prevent. Its menus are completely inscrutable. But I'm not even talking about usability. One can learn anything eventually, given enough willpower. I'm imagining a processor like the one on the iPhone/iPad Pro acting on all those pixels. And a true software platform running on top of it.
  - FPGAhacker 8y ago
    > Please explain. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_QuickTake https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_QuickTake
    - tambourine_man 8y ago
      You mean the first successful consumer digital camera?
  - toast0 8y ago
    That's exactly the problem. If you put Apple or Google in charge, you'll get a true software platform acting on all those people. That's going to make everything slow and terrible. The beauty of a DSLR is that you turn it on, and it's ready to go. Take pictures in raw and process them when you get home. If you want to adjust the exposure and what not, you can; if you do that a lot, you can get the higher model cameras with more dials, and customizable buttons so you don't have to go through menus as much.
    - tambourine_man 8y ago
      I don't know about Android, but the Camera app on iOS is extremely responsive. And I envy the amount of processing that goes on when you press the button. From turning a noisy mess from a fingernail size sensor into pretty good JPGs to auto choosing the best photo from crazy fast burst mode, even before you press the button! And audio/video, oh boy. Hyper slow motion 4k, noise canceling… Imagine what Apple/Google could do with something the size and weight of a DSLR and 3k US$ budget.
      - intertextuality 8y ago
        I hate my iphone x camera because it's slow. I have to double and triple check that it's focusing on the right thing and hold the phone really steady. It is adequate for me because I always carry my phone with me, but I would never want a general approach to a real DSLR or mirrorless camera. Apple/Google would add too many features, focus on wifi connectivity, and generally ruin the one amazing thing about cameras–the ability to turn them on and immediately take photos, no fuss. No waiting for software updates, or alerts, or any of the million other things that do not belong in a camera.
        jaytaylor 8y ago
        Double tap the power button on Android and it'll be ready to snap pics in 3 seconds or less. No popups or other dialogs. Not bad.
        8y ago
  - Jedd 8y ago
    > Please explain. Not parent, but FF-lust is objectively bizarre. Read this (now very old) rant on the subject [1] Then consider advances in optics, CAD, sensors, and then marvel at why some people are desperate for an arbitrary sensor size that plucked out of the air more than a hundred years ago. [1] http://www.digitalsecrets.net/secrets/FullFrameWars.html http://www.digitalsecrets.net/secrets/FullFrameWars.html
    - tambourine_man 8y ago
      I’m very much aware of it, believe me. Nothing spatial in 35mm, it’s just that we have a ton of amazing glass made and bought to go with it. And even though there are diminishing returns, quality wise, the more photons the better. I’m sure they could make APS-C, Micro 4/3, 4x5”, to please everyone. I wouldn’t complain :)
  - frankchn 8y ago
    > I'm imagining a processor like the one on the iPhone/iPad Pro acting on all those pixels. And a true software platform running on top of it. I think a lot of professionals and prosumers who are still buying interchangeable lens cameras don’t care. Folks generally shoot in RAW and edit their photos on a PC with Photoshop and Lightroom, which affords people much more control and is much more powerful than whatever is in an iPad. The only photographers shooting JPEGs are sports and news photographers, and they have specialized use cases. That’s why the pro cameras (1DX2 and D5) come with Gigabit Ethernet and auto-upload to an FTP server through that. People want the pre-capture sequence to be reliable and easy to use (so lots of buttons and dials) and in general once the photo is captured and saved, they don’t care and don’t want the camera involved any more. Of course, if people really want to upload to Instagram immediately, most cameras nowadays come with Wifi so they can just transfer photos to a smartphone and do whatever they need to do there.
    - tambourine_man 8y ago
      Not all processing can be done in post. A lot goes on before RAWs are recorded that could benefit from faster hardware and better software. An iPad Pro has one heck of a CPU/GPU, rivaling high end laptops, where most edits are made. Having something like that (and custom silicon, perhaps) dedicated to pro photo/video/audio is something we haven’t seen.
      - frankchn 8y ago
        Do you know what is being done to the data between coming off the sensor and being saved to a RAW file? My impression is that other than dead/hot pixel mapping and some degree of noise reduction, not much else is done (at least in Canon-land). Even if the camera can do more post-processing, I am not sure I want it to. I would rather the camera do less after exposure is complete, so I can get more control over it while editing.
        tambourine_man 8y ago
        At the very least there’s signal amplification (and possible highlight clipping) at higher than baseline ISO. Otherwise you'd get a very dark image indeed.
cepp 8y ago
While I disagree with your original point that Apple/Google should get into the camera manufacture space, Zeiss is working on a new "next generation" camera system. It's targeted at the RX1/Leica Q market, but with significantly better software and obviously great optics. https://zx1.zeiss.com/ https://zx1.zeiss.com/
jordache 8y ago
Really? A general purpose OS, to replace the firmware and physical controls honed over decades and used by professional photographers in all kinds of scenarios? You think that highly of smartphone makers? Would you want them to re-make the aircraft cockpit too?
- Pangurbon 8y ago
  Seems like you could embed camera firmware either in the sensor or in iOS/Android. Maybe not.
  - jordache 8y ago
    the dude's talking about terrible software from camera makers, and want iOS or Android software to power his professional camera.
- tambourine_man 8y ago
  >A general purpose OS, to replace the firmware… Yes, please. And a kickass processor with crazy fast memory to go along with it. >and physical controls honed over decades and used by professional photographers in all kinds of scenarios? Not at all. We love knobs, rings and wheels with great distinguishable tactile feeling. A more intuitive settings menu would be a side benefit. Truly revolutionary would be to able to write first class software to a mature capable OS. What could the state of the art in demosaic, noise, latitude, color accuracy be with that kind of speed and tools?
  - jordache 8y ago
    So in other words, you don't mind if your camera's battery drains mysteriously.. Let's get a battery discharge graph in there so you can debug the process that's killing the battery!
    - tambourine_man 8y ago
      Does this happen to your phone? Mine is a supercomputer that fits my pocket with battery that lasts all day. I trust them to make something that can be at least 10X thicker and heavier to performer comparably.
dharma1 8y ago
I think slowly they will get there with phones. Camera arrays with 3-5 sensors will be common on phones in 1-2 years. That way you get to keep lens sizes very small, but your effective sensor size is quite large, and you can do a lot of other cool computational photography tricks with multiple sensors.
- tambourine_man 8y ago
  I think so too, but we could get there sooner and better with big, high quality light gathering goodies.
  - dharma1 8y ago
    yeah, I would probably buy one. But perhaps most people don't feel like they need a dslr since phone cameras are getting so good, and dslr's are quite large and heavy. With a full frame sensor your glass is going to be large/heavy
arghwhat 8y ago
Honestly, I think that would be an awful downgrade. The software on, say, a Canon camera is fast, reliable and easy to use. Magic Lantern is "just" about adding even more advanced advanced and/or obscure features.
- tambourine_man 8y ago
  >The software on, say, a Canon camera is fast, reliable and easy to use. I think this is Stockholm syndrome speaking. Most photographers have no problems installing apps and upgrading their phones. Yet ask them to set a timer, change focus/metering point and it's a nightmare. Let's not even talk about Canon's camera control/export app, whatever it's called. Software is hard.
  - StavrosK 8y ago
    What photographer can't change the metering without even looking at the camera? It's literally the thumb knob.
    - tambourine_man 8y ago
      I’m taking about Matrix Metering, Center-weighted or Spot Metering. I deal with photographers in their 50s/60s weakly. They all love their phones and hate the menu screen on their Canon/Nikon/Sony. You set it up the way you like it and hope to never need to touch it again. Time how long it takes you to find and change the Exif copywrite on your photos, daylight saving, or how to save JPGs in one card and RAWs in another. It’s a nightmare.
      - Eiriksmal 8y ago
        http://www.kenrockwell.com/canon/images/80d/810_9029-top.jpg http://www.kenrockwell.com/canon/images/80d/810_9029-top.jpg https://www.ephotozine.com/articles/canon-eos-1d-x-mark-ii-vs-1d-x-vs-nikon-d5-comparison-28795/images/highres-nikon-d5-top-recropped_1454493020.jpg https://www.ephotozine.com/articles/canon-eos-1d-x-mark-ii-v... This might blow your mind, but professionally-oriented cameras all have dedicated buttons to toggle metering modes without looking away from the viewfinder.
jazzyjackson 8y ago
Apple is allergic to buttons so I can't see them producing a camera with a real user interface (knobs and rings and so on) Leica T series is probably pretty close to what they would come up with tho. Solid block of metal, and nothing but screen on the back.
- tambourine_man 8y ago
  Modern Apple is, and probably because getting rid of a moving part at iPhone scale is great for manufacturing and avoiding breakage But they can make great physical buttons. That last iPhone home button was one of the best in the industry. I bet Jony Ive and Phil Schiller love Leicas
  - JimmyAustin 8y ago
    If I remember correctly, Steve Jobs compared the iPhone 4's design to a Leica.
    - tambourine_man 8y ago
      You do: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wn3OCIcE8ds&t=95s https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wn3OCIcE8ds&t=95s
- StavrosK 8y ago
  You can't work like that. I have a 5D and a Sony RX-100, and, given that I've taken good enough photos with my phone, the differences in the sensor are relatively minor. The UX differences, however, are light years apart. It takes me tens of seconds to change the settings like I want them on the Sony, whereas on the Canon they're a knob away. I'm pretty sure that the major difference between a pro and a consumer camera is the amount of easily accessible buttons and knobs.
  - Eiriksmal 8y ago
    >I'm pretty sure that the major difference between a pro and a consumer camera is the amount of easily accessible buttons and knobs. Precisely this. After 10K shots on a Canon 1200D, I upgraded to an 80D specifically to have access to the top controls to quickly change settings while shooting. You can remap a lot of the 1200D's controls in the "Expert Feature"/customizations section, but the 80D's extra ergonomics are a true joy. The camera is molded to my hands and comfortable to wield for hours at a time. I can't say the same for the smartphones I shoot with. My Blackberry KeyOne's camera has fully manual controls (even the focus distance can be manually set!), but the "slide your finger to control settings" UI sometimes feels like the "Reddit designs volume control" experiment from a few years ago. I empathize with the Java programmers, but it's extremely frustrating to tell the smartphone what kind of picture I want. It should go without saying that it's equally frustrating to be unable to hold the slab phone adequately still. Reading people's passionate hatred for real cameras makes it quite clear that they aren't the target audience for a simple mid-range DSLR, let alone monsters like the 1D or Nikon D5.
sixothree 8y ago
I agree that they can learn much. When was the last time a camera software update included new features....
the8472 8y ago
The hardware is not that great when it comes to connectivity. canon is behind on remote control via wifi and only got usb3 support in the latest models.
sytelus 8y ago
I've basically given up on whole DSLR thing after investing in it too much precisely because of this sorry state of their software. My phone camera that is 10X lighter in weight and size has far many more features I need than these stupid DSLR firmwares. Yes, quality isn't that great if you are one of those pixel-level scrutinizer but you can't beat getting 240-FPS video or 270-degree panoramas so effortlessly. The only reason crappy DSLR firmwares are surviving is because they offer lots of low level knobs that people with huge amount of patience and time can put to some good use. I have never understood why giants like Cannon and Nikon can't match feature set, ease of use etc from smartphones. In many ways this is playing out like it did with Kodak where they set on their traditional things for so long that there was ultimately no point of return.
- bufferoverflow 8y ago
  You can't seriously compare a tiny phone camera with a full frame DSLR. You simply cannot take certain types of photos with your phone due to optics and the size of the sensor.
Chuzam 8y ago
I have the same thoughts. Why do I have to relinquish all the niceties I'm used to from my phone in my 3000 € camera? What could be done if we had the computational power from phones combined with the high quality data from a big sensor?
tambourine_man 8y ago
This tread got a bit out of hand, so I'll try to summarise my thoughts here: I find computational photography incredibly exiting, but it's mostly taking place in smartphone space, with tiny sensors and lenses. Imagine what we could do with great glass and a huge honking sensor.

dpwm 8y ago

> Imagine if Apple and Google made full frame cameras. I did – briefly – and am still recoiling from the horror. > Currently we have great hardware with terrible software and vice-versa. The software on even older DSLRs isn't terrible. It does the job it was intended to do quite well. It is learn-able, and it doesn't change its behaviour with an OTA-update you can't easily prevent. More thought has gone into the UI design of even the earliest, rushed-to-market DSLR firmwares than some of the UI changes that Apple and Google have inflicted on their victims.

tambourine_man 8y ago
> I did – briefly – and am still recoiling from the horror. Please explain. > The software on even older DSLRs isn't terrible. Oh yes it is. Like salt on a fresh wound. > It does the job it was intended to do quite well. It is learn-able, and it doesn't change its behaviour with an OTA-update you can't easily prevent. Its menus are completely inscrutable. But I'm not even talking about usability. One can learn anything eventually, given enough willpower. I'm imagining a processor like the one on the iPhone/iPad Pro acting on all those pixels. And a true software platform running on top of it.
- FPGAhacker 8y ago
  > Please explain. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_QuickTake https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_QuickTake
  - tambourine_man 8y ago
    You mean the first successful consumer digital camera?
- toast0 8y ago
  That's exactly the problem. If you put Apple or Google in charge, you'll get a true software platform acting on all those people. That's going to make everything slow and terrible. The beauty of a DSLR is that you turn it on, and it's ready to go. Take pictures in raw and process them when you get home. If you want to adjust the exposure and what not, you can; if you do that a lot, you can get the higher model cameras with more dials, and customizable buttons so you don't have to go through menus as much.
  - tambourine_man 8y ago
    I don't know about Android, but the Camera app on iOS is extremely responsive. And I envy the amount of processing that goes on when you press the button. From turning a noisy mess from a fingernail size sensor into pretty good JPGs to auto choosing the best photo from crazy fast burst mode, even before you press the button! And audio/video, oh boy. Hyper slow motion 4k, noise canceling… Imagine what Apple/Google could do with something the size and weight of a DSLR and 3k US$ budget.
    - intertextuality 8y ago
      I hate my iphone x camera because it's slow. I have to double and triple check that it's focusing on the right thing and hold the phone really steady. It is adequate for me because I always carry my phone with me, but I would never want a general approach to a real DSLR or mirrorless camera. Apple/Google would add too many features, focus on wifi connectivity, and generally ruin the one amazing thing about cameras–the ability to turn them on and immediately take photos, no fuss. No waiting for software updates, or alerts, or any of the million other things that do not belong in a camera.
      - jaytaylor 8y ago
        Double tap the power button on Android and it'll be ready to snap pics in 3 seconds or less. No popups or other dialogs. Not bad.
        8y ago
- Jedd 8y ago
  > Please explain. Not parent, but FF-lust is objectively bizarre. Read this (now very old) rant on the subject [1] Then consider advances in optics, CAD, sensors, and then marvel at why some people are desperate for an arbitrary sensor size that plucked out of the air more than a hundred years ago. [1] http://www.digitalsecrets.net/secrets/FullFrameWars.html http://www.digitalsecrets.net/secrets/FullFrameWars.html
  - tambourine_man 8y ago
    I’m very much aware of it, believe me. Nothing spatial in 35mm, it’s just that we have a ton of amazing glass made and bought to go with it. And even though there are diminishing returns, quality wise, the more photons the better. I’m sure they could make APS-C, Micro 4/3, 4x5”, to please everyone. I wouldn’t complain :)
- frankchn 8y ago
  > I'm imagining a processor like the one on the iPhone/iPad Pro acting on all those pixels. And a true software platform running on top of it. I think a lot of professionals and prosumers who are still buying interchangeable lens cameras don’t care. Folks generally shoot in RAW and edit their photos on a PC with Photoshop and Lightroom, which affords people much more control and is much more powerful than whatever is in an iPad. The only photographers shooting JPEGs are sports and news photographers, and they have specialized use cases. That’s why the pro cameras (1DX2 and D5) come with Gigabit Ethernet and auto-upload to an FTP server through that. People want the pre-capture sequence to be reliable and easy to use (so lots of buttons and dials) and in general once the photo is captured and saved, they don’t care and don’t want the camera involved any more. Of course, if people really want to upload to Instagram immediately, most cameras nowadays come with Wifi so they can just transfer photos to a smartphone and do whatever they need to do there.
  - tambourine_man 8y ago
    Not all processing can be done in post. A lot goes on before RAWs are recorded that could benefit from faster hardware and better software. An iPad Pro has one heck of a CPU/GPU, rivaling high end laptops, where most edits are made. Having something like that (and custom silicon, perhaps) dedicated to pro photo/video/audio is something we haven’t seen.
    - frankchn 8y ago
      Do you know what is being done to the data between coming off the sensor and being saved to a RAW file? My impression is that other than dead/hot pixel mapping and some degree of noise reduction, not much else is done (at least in Canon-land). Even if the camera can do more post-processing, I am not sure I want it to. I would rather the camera do less after exposure is complete, so I can get more control over it while editing.
      - tambourine_man 8y ago
        At the very least there’s signal amplification (and possible highlight clipping) at higher than baseline ISO. Otherwise you'd get a very dark image indeed.

cepp 8y ago

While I disagree with your original point that Apple/Google should get into the camera manufacture space, Zeiss is working on a new "next generation" camera system. It's targeted at the RX1/Leica Q market, but with significantly better software and obviously great optics. https://zx1.zeiss.com/ https://zx1.zeiss.com/

jordache 8y ago

Really? A general purpose OS, to replace the firmware and physical controls honed over decades and used by professional photographers in all kinds of scenarios? You think that highly of smartphone makers? Would you want them to re-make the aircraft cockpit too?

Pangurbon 8y ago
Seems like you could embed camera firmware either in the sensor or in iOS/Android. Maybe not.
- jordache 8y ago
  the dude's talking about terrible software from camera makers, and want iOS or Android software to power his professional camera.
tambourine_man 8y ago
>A general purpose OS, to replace the firmware… Yes, please. And a kickass processor with crazy fast memory to go along with it. >and physical controls honed over decades and used by professional photographers in all kinds of scenarios? Not at all. We love knobs, rings and wheels with great distinguishable tactile feeling. A more intuitive settings menu would be a side benefit. Truly revolutionary would be to able to write first class software to a mature capable OS. What could the state of the art in demosaic, noise, latitude, color accuracy be with that kind of speed and tools?
- jordache 8y ago
  So in other words, you don't mind if your camera's battery drains mysteriously.. Let's get a battery discharge graph in there so you can debug the process that's killing the battery!
  - tambourine_man 8y ago
    Does this happen to your phone? Mine is a supercomputer that fits my pocket with battery that lasts all day. I trust them to make something that can be at least 10X thicker and heavier to performer comparably.

dharma1 8y ago

I think slowly they will get there with phones. Camera arrays with 3-5 sensors will be common on phones in 1-2 years. That way you get to keep lens sizes very small, but your effective sensor size is quite large, and you can do a lot of other cool computational photography tricks with multiple sensors.

tambourine_man 8y ago
I think so too, but we could get there sooner and better with big, high quality light gathering goodies.
- dharma1 8y ago
  yeah, I would probably buy one. But perhaps most people don't feel like they need a dslr since phone cameras are getting so good, and dslr's are quite large and heavy. With a full frame sensor your glass is going to be large/heavy

arghwhat 8y ago

Honestly, I think that would be an awful downgrade. The software on, say, a Canon camera is fast, reliable and easy to use. Magic Lantern is "just" about adding even more advanced advanced and/or obscure features.

tambourine_man 8y ago
>The software on, say, a Canon camera is fast, reliable and easy to use. I think this is Stockholm syndrome speaking. Most photographers have no problems installing apps and upgrading their phones. Yet ask them to set a timer, change focus/metering point and it's a nightmare. Let's not even talk about Canon's camera control/export app, whatever it's called. Software is hard.
- StavrosK 8y ago
  What photographer can't change the metering without even looking at the camera? It's literally the thumb knob.
  - tambourine_man 8y ago
    I’m taking about Matrix Metering, Center-weighted or Spot Metering. I deal with photographers in their 50s/60s weakly. They all love their phones and hate the menu screen on their Canon/Nikon/Sony. You set it up the way you like it and hope to never need to touch it again. Time how long it takes you to find and change the Exif copywrite on your photos, daylight saving, or how to save JPGs in one card and RAWs in another. It’s a nightmare.
    - Eiriksmal 8y ago
      http://www.kenrockwell.com/canon/images/80d/810_9029-top.jpg http://www.kenrockwell.com/canon/images/80d/810_9029-top.jpg https://www.ephotozine.com/articles/canon-eos-1d-x-mark-ii-vs-1d-x-vs-nikon-d5-comparison-28795/images/highres-nikon-d5-top-recropped_1454493020.jpg https://www.ephotozine.com/articles/canon-eos-1d-x-mark-ii-v... This might blow your mind, but professionally-oriented cameras all have dedicated buttons to toggle metering modes without looking away from the viewfinder.

jazzyjackson 8y ago

Apple is allergic to buttons so I can't see them producing a camera with a real user interface (knobs and rings and so on) Leica T series is probably pretty close to what they would come up with tho. Solid block of metal, and nothing but screen on the back.

tambourine_man 8y ago
Modern Apple is, and probably because getting rid of a moving part at iPhone scale is great for manufacturing and avoiding breakage But they can make great physical buttons. That last iPhone home button was one of the best in the industry. I bet Jony Ive and Phil Schiller love Leicas
- JimmyAustin 8y ago
  If I remember correctly, Steve Jobs compared the iPhone 4's design to a Leica.
  - tambourine_man 8y ago
    You do: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wn3OCIcE8ds&t=95s https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wn3OCIcE8ds&t=95s
StavrosK 8y ago
You can't work like that. I have a 5D and a Sony RX-100, and, given that I've taken good enough photos with my phone, the differences in the sensor are relatively minor. The UX differences, however, are light years apart. It takes me tens of seconds to change the settings like I want them on the Sony, whereas on the Canon they're a knob away. I'm pretty sure that the major difference between a pro and a consumer camera is the amount of easily accessible buttons and knobs.
- Eiriksmal 8y ago
  >I'm pretty sure that the major difference between a pro and a consumer camera is the amount of easily accessible buttons and knobs. Precisely this. After 10K shots on a Canon 1200D, I upgraded to an 80D specifically to have access to the top controls to quickly change settings while shooting. You can remap a lot of the 1200D's controls in the "Expert Feature"/customizations section, but the 80D's extra ergonomics are a true joy. The camera is molded to my hands and comfortable to wield for hours at a time. I can't say the same for the smartphones I shoot with. My Blackberry KeyOne's camera has fully manual controls (even the focus distance can be manually set!), but the "slide your finger to control settings" UI sometimes feels like the "Reddit designs volume control" experiment from a few years ago. I empathize with the Java programmers, but it's extremely frustrating to tell the smartphone what kind of picture I want. It should go without saying that it's equally frustrating to be unable to hold the slab phone adequately still. Reading people's passionate hatred for real cameras makes it quite clear that they aren't the target audience for a simple mid-range DSLR, let alone monsters like the 1D or Nikon D5.

sixothree 8y ago

I agree that they can learn much. When was the last time a camera software update included new features....

the8472 8y ago

The hardware is not that great when it comes to connectivity. canon is behind on remote control via wifi and only got usb3 support in the latest models.

sytelus 8y ago

I've basically given up on whole DSLR thing after investing in it too much precisely because of this sorry state of their software. My phone camera that is 10X lighter in weight and size has far many more features I need than these stupid DSLR firmwares. Yes, quality isn't that great if you are one of those pixel-level scrutinizer but you can't beat getting 240-FPS video or 270-degree panoramas so effortlessly. The only reason crappy DSLR firmwares are surviving is because they offer lots of low level knobs that people with huge amount of patience and time can put to some good use. I have never understood why giants like Cannon and Nikon can't match feature set, ease of use etc from smartphones. In many ways this is playing out like it did with Kodak where they set on their traditional things for so long that there was ultimately no point of return.

bufferoverflow 8y ago
You can't seriously compare a tiny phone camera with a full frame DSLR. You simply cannot take certain types of photos with your phone due to optics and the size of the sensor.

Chuzam 8y ago

I have the same thoughts. Why do I have to relinquish all the niceties I'm used to from my phone in my 3000 € camera? What could be done if we had the computational power from phones combined with the high quality data from a big sensor?

tambourine_man 8y ago

This tread got a bit out of hand, so I'll try to summarise my thoughts here: I find computational photography incredibly exiting, but it's mostly taking place in smartphone space, with tiny sensors and lenses. Imagine what we could do with great glass and a huge honking sensor.