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You can't create tools for censorship in China and support a free and open Internet. Those things are completely opposed to each other. Pointing out the action

You can't create tools for censorship in China and support a free and open Internet. Those things are completely opposed to each other. Pointing out the actions of other companies, the good things Google has done, or the fact that they censor content in most countries doesn't negate that fact. Those are just mediocre argumentative tactics to try and downplay a public relations disaster. We're not even dealing with the same Google from 9 years ago. Here's some good reading for everyone about how Google went out of it's way to protect Chinese dissidents and refused to comply with the Chinese government. Now they're doing the opposite: https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2010/01/new-approach-to-china.html https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2010/01/new-approach-to-chin...

johncolanduoni 8y ago
> You can't create tools for censorship in China and support a free and open Internet. Those things are completely opposed to each other. I don't see why Google wouldn't actually prefer if China didn't have such draconian restrictions. At the very least it would reduce their regulatory compliance work in China drastically.
ehsankia 8y ago
> You can't create tools for censorship in China and support a free and open Internet What does following local laws of one specific country have to do with the open global internet? You do realize that Chinese internet is already behind a firewall, and is not open, right? > Google went out of it's way to protect Chinese dissidents And we have absolutely facts about what they were working on with Dragonfly, except leaks from a source which was very clearly biased against the project. For all we know, they were coming up with new tech that allowed them to provide services to Chinese citizen while still protecting them. That to me makes much more sense as to why they were considering re-entering, than the baseless "they were only doing it for the money" reasoning.
- calibas 8y ago
  You're acting like your guesses are just as good as The Intercept's investigation, and all to defend Google! Why are you doing PR for them?
  - hopler 8y ago
    Whether Google is in China or not, China Internet is not free and open. That's simply not Google's choice. The people with guns and tanks in China decide that. Judge Google by what they do the Internet where they have power, with browser tech and HTTP standards and AMP and DNS and YouTube and whatever.
    - calibas 8y ago
      They do have power here, all they need to do is not secretly partner with an oppressive regime to assist them with censoring the Internet. That's quite easy to do, hell, I'm doing it right now... All you've done is framed the situation in a way that makes it seem like Google isn't responsible for it's own actions.
    - ionised 8y ago
      > China Internet is not free and open. Then Google should have nothing to do with it. Otherwise they are not supportive of 'a free and open internet', but are actively supporting a close, censored and controlled internet. It's pretty simple.

johncolanduoni 8y ago

> You can't create tools for censorship in China and support a free and open Internet. Those things are completely opposed to each other. I don't see why Google wouldn't actually prefer if China didn't have such draconian restrictions. At the very least it would reduce their regulatory compliance work in China drastically.

ehsankia 8y ago

> You can't create tools for censorship in China and support a free and open Internet What does following local laws of one specific country have to do with the open global internet? You do realize that Chinese internet is already behind a firewall, and is not open, right? > Google went out of it's way to protect Chinese dissidents And we have absolutely facts about what they were working on with Dragonfly, except leaks from a source which was very clearly biased against the project. For all we know, they were coming up with new tech that allowed them to provide services to Chinese citizen while still protecting them. That to me makes much more sense as to why they were considering re-entering, than the baseless "they were only doing it for the money" reasoning.

calibas 8y ago
You're acting like your guesses are just as good as The Intercept's investigation, and all to defend Google! Why are you doing PR for them?
- hopler 8y ago
  Whether Google is in China or not, China Internet is not free and open. That's simply not Google's choice. The people with guns and tanks in China decide that. Judge Google by what they do the Internet where they have power, with browser tech and HTTP standards and AMP and DNS and YouTube and whatever.
  - calibas 8y ago
    They do have power here, all they need to do is not secretly partner with an oppressive regime to assist them with censoring the Internet. That's quite easy to do, hell, I'm doing it right now... All you've done is framed the situation in a way that makes it seem like Google isn't responsible for it's own actions.
  - ionised 8y ago
    > China Internet is not free and open. Then Google should have nothing to do with it. Otherwise they are not supportive of 'a free and open internet', but are actively supporting a close, censored and controlled internet. It's pretty simple.