5 ms·

Would you be willing to share your ideas on what can be done at the beginning of the pipeline?

by dpflan 8y ago

adamnemecek 8y ago
Good primary and secondary education systems and affordable colleges.
- mixmastamyk 8y ago
  Countering American anti-intellectualism is needed as well.
  - joelfolksy 8y ago
    Yep. America hasn't even started to reckon with the attitudes encapsulated in the n word (no, not that one, the other one).
malvosenior 8y ago
Step one (and really the only step) is that people have to want to become developers/scientists, sit in front of a computer all day, read and learn, all the time. There are a million different reasons someone may not want to do that or may be encouraged against it, but you'd have to look at every individual and culture to find out why. It may not even turn out to be a bad thing. What if someone wants to become a chef or athlete instead, is that a problem?
- dpflan 8y ago
  For choosing a major and career I think step makes sense but I think that is near the end of the pipeline. What about exposure to the field and introducing computational thinking into earlier pars of the education system? Not necessary making kids program as their first exposure, but exposing them to computational concepts (maybe start with power of twos when learning multiplication, or control-flow-logic for writing a story....).
  - crististm 8y ago
    There are so many hours in a day. Exposure to computation as opposed to not exposing to what? What would you trade this with?
  - malvosenior 8y ago
    I think that's a great idea. Honestly I don't think any culture in the west has ever been truly supportive of becoming a STEM person. Until very recently is was extremely derided in even white American culture as being "for nerds". A more positive exposure to technology at an early age can only be a good thing. I think we'll still find very few people want to become engineers due to the required workload and that will be ok.
  - jameane 8y ago
    I think even more helpful would be framing how this actually translates into the real world - what does this sort of thing enable in the real world. I loved the show Numbers because it was a show about how math helped detectives solve crimes. Way more interesting than just doing algebra about speeding trains. I think sometimes there is an idea that everyone has the same problem and your problem is universal. For example I heard about a hackathon for black and latino kids. And the ideas that came out of it were really different. One app was a social networking platform for private school kids to connect with other black private school kids to talk about their experiences and vent. Another idea was a payment app to send money to Mexico without having to go to Western Union or whatever. There is a startup in Oakland that has an app to help people who are caught up in the criminal justice system to keep track of court appearances and hearings and stuff so they don't need to go to jail for bogus stuff like missing a court appearance. Technology has the opportunity to enable and transform - if we make sure everyone has access.
- xiphias2 8y ago
  Young girls/women have much more sexual value than young guys in general, so it makes sense for them to invest more in their social life and looks, and less in their future earning potential. Still, it can be changed: in China studying is increasing social value much more than in Europe / US for example.
ben_jones 8y ago
In my experience the theme of what someone wants to do as a career often forms in high school. Programming/software is equated to the more introverted gamer/robotics types which often confers lower popularity and social status then other extra-curricular activities. Men and women alike choose to opt out of programming for this reason, although the absence of women is much more heavily felt.
crowdpleaser 8y ago
Sure, instill discipline in schools. Go to a school of 'underrepresented minorities' and you'll see an incredible amount of misbehavior. Anyone who struggles to listen and not gratify their most immediate desires will probably fail to develop technical skills. Also, immediate suspension for kids who bully academically-inclined students for 'acting white'. Not only is it a racially charged statement that probably has no place in school (or so progs would tell us), but it seems levied exclusively against the kids who need education the most.
- jameane 8y ago
  Maybe have a little empathy here. In a low-income school, kids are walking in the door with way more problems than your upper middle class school where most kids have their basic needs met. Also, it is time to retire this stereotype that every non-white kid who is academically inclined is being bullied for acting white at school all the time. I get the most grief from white kids about "acting white" growing up. From fellow black kids it was pretty rare - 1-2 times. Mostly other kids were more inclined to help uplift me.
  - deogeo 8y ago
    > upper middle class The US is a long way from having its entire white population in the upper middle class: http://www.nccp.org/media/releases/release_34.html http://www.nccp.org/media/releases/release_34.html

Would you be willing to share your ideas on what can be done at the beginning of the pipeline?

by dpflan 8y ago

Would you be willing to share your ideas on what can be done at the beginning of the pipeline?

adamnemecek 8y ago

Good primary and secondary education systems and affordable colleges.

mixmastamyk 8y ago
Countering American anti-intellectualism is needed as well.
- joelfolksy 8y ago
  Yep. America hasn't even started to reckon with the attitudes encapsulated in the n word (no, not that one, the other one).

malvosenior 8y ago

Step one (and really the only step) is that people have to want to become developers/scientists, sit in front of a computer all day, read and learn, all the time. There are a million different reasons someone may not want to do that or may be encouraged against it, but you'd have to look at every individual and culture to find out why. It may not even turn out to be a bad thing. What if someone wants to become a chef or athlete instead, is that a problem?

dpflan 8y ago
For choosing a major and career I think step makes sense but I think that is near the end of the pipeline. What about exposure to the field and introducing computational thinking into earlier pars of the education system? Not necessary making kids program as their first exposure, but exposing them to computational concepts (maybe start with power of twos when learning multiplication, or control-flow-logic for writing a story....).
- crististm 8y ago
  There are so many hours in a day. Exposure to computation as opposed to not exposing to what? What would you trade this with?
- malvosenior 8y ago
  I think that's a great idea. Honestly I don't think any culture in the west has ever been truly supportive of becoming a STEM person. Until very recently is was extremely derided in even white American culture as being "for nerds". A more positive exposure to technology at an early age can only be a good thing. I think we'll still find very few people want to become engineers due to the required workload and that will be ok.
- jameane 8y ago
  I think even more helpful would be framing how this actually translates into the real world - what does this sort of thing enable in the real world. I loved the show Numbers because it was a show about how math helped detectives solve crimes. Way more interesting than just doing algebra about speeding trains. I think sometimes there is an idea that everyone has the same problem and your problem is universal. For example I heard about a hackathon for black and latino kids. And the ideas that came out of it were really different. One app was a social networking platform for private school kids to connect with other black private school kids to talk about their experiences and vent. Another idea was a payment app to send money to Mexico without having to go to Western Union or whatever. There is a startup in Oakland that has an app to help people who are caught up in the criminal justice system to keep track of court appearances and hearings and stuff so they don't need to go to jail for bogus stuff like missing a court appearance. Technology has the opportunity to enable and transform - if we make sure everyone has access.
xiphias2 8y ago
Young girls/women have much more sexual value than young guys in general, so it makes sense for them to invest more in their social life and looks, and less in their future earning potential. Still, it can be changed: in China studying is increasing social value much more than in Europe / US for example.

ben_jones 8y ago

In my experience the theme of what someone wants to do as a career often forms in high school. Programming/software is equated to the more introverted gamer/robotics types which often confers lower popularity and social status then other extra-curricular activities. Men and women alike choose to opt out of programming for this reason, although the absence of women is much more heavily felt.

crowdpleaser 8y ago

Sure, instill discipline in schools. Go to a school of 'underrepresented minorities' and you'll see an incredible amount of misbehavior. Anyone who struggles to listen and not gratify their most immediate desires will probably fail to develop technical skills. Also, immediate suspension for kids who bully academically-inclined students for 'acting white'. Not only is it a racially charged statement that probably has no place in school (or so progs would tell us), but it seems levied exclusively against the kids who need education the most.

jameane 8y ago
Maybe have a little empathy here. In a low-income school, kids are walking in the door with way more problems than your upper middle class school where most kids have their basic needs met. Also, it is time to retire this stereotype that every non-white kid who is academically inclined is being bullied for acting white at school all the time. I get the most grief from white kids about "acting white" growing up. From fellow black kids it was pretty rare - 1-2 times. Mostly other kids were more inclined to help uplift me.
- deogeo 8y ago
  > upper middle class The US is a long way from having its entire white population in the upper middle class: http://www.nccp.org/media/releases/release_34.html http://www.nccp.org/media/releases/release_34.html