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Xinjiang: Ex-Blackwater chief's security firm linked to China training centre

72 points by seagullz 8y ago

clanrebornsx 8y ago
This is capitalism. Anyone surprised? "Let money talk, nobody cares about the ethics" - Facebook employee on blind
nabla9 8y ago
The immediate shutdown of FBI’s war crimes unit is easier to understand under the light of these type revelations. Mercenaries, Saudis and others have incentive to lobby for shutdown because the unit is a threat to the individuals within the United State who may have committed these types of crimes.
- pcbro141 8y ago
  Additionally, Erik Prince (ex-Blackwater chief) held informal roles in the Trump transition team, establishing channels with various foreign governments (including clients of his). He has also been an informal advisor to the White House. His sister is also Secretary of Education Betsy DeVos.
walrus01 8y ago
Many previous articles in the nytimes: https://www.google.ca/search?q=nytimes+xinjiang https://www.google.ca/search?q=nytimes+xinjiang Let's not forget that a member of the UN security council is apparently running prison camps for an ethnic/religious minority. Foreign journalists are severely restricted from working in Xinjiang.
- skytayloriii 8y ago
  > a member of the UN security council is apparently running prison camps for an ethnic/religious minority. You can say the name China lol China isn't scary like voldemort. In fact, China is a paper tiger desperately trying to oppress its citizens because its economy is collapsing. China's import fell 10% in january, and expect to drop 20% in february. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-trade/china-january-exports-imports-seen-falling-again-in-blow-to-global-growth-reuters-poll-idUSKCN1Q10D5 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-trade/china.... It is in a long term decline, says morgan stanley, as it will have a account deficit not seen since 1993. https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/13/china-economy-morgan-stanley-predicts-chinas-account-deficit-in-2019.html https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/13/china-economy-morgan-stanley.... Home sales in January declined 56%! across 14 major cities https://www.scmp.com/property/hong-kong-china/article/2185836/china-new-home-sales-decline-56-cent-during-lunar-new-year https://www.scmp.com/property/hong-kong-china/article/218583... Chinese firms are suffering from a wave of default. The government is propping up state firms and squeezing profits out of the private firms. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-debt/debt-guarantee-tangle-chinas-private-firms-hit-by-default-contagion-idUSKCN1Q107W https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-debt/debt-g... It will continue its internal oppression because it has no chance of winning any war against the West or any of its neighbors. However, perhaps after some building up of its navy and airforce in a few years, it will think it has a shot.
  - plink 8y ago
    Your Voldemort reference was genuinely hilarious. It also evokes a real unnameableness embedded in this subject: that US courts have determined it slanderous to speak the term "ponzi" in describing the DeVos family's great American fortune.
    - WillPostForFood 8y ago
      US courts have determined it slanderous to speak the term "ponzi" in describing the DeVos family's great American fortune Do you have a citation for that? People criticize Amway as a pyramid or Ponzi scheme all the time.
      - plink 8y ago
        Touché! Such a citation would help elevate my post out of the realm of mere glibness. I must apologize, though, that it wasn’t a court case but an FTC decision: https://www.ftc.gov/sites/default/files/documents/commission_decision_volumes/volume-93/ftc_volume_decision_93_january_-_june_1979pages_618-738.pdf https://www.ftc.gov/sites/default/files/documents/commission... On a related point, I am unable to prove, owing to the destruction of many DeVos family documents in the Great Fire of Massachusetts’s port town of Innsmouth, that Betsy DeVos’s real maiden name is humanly unpronounceable and that the Blackwater Company is a cryptic nod to Lake R’lyeh.
ohaideredevs 8y ago
If anyone is interested, Erik Prince is also in Saudi Arabia: https://www.google.com/search?q=blackwater+saudi+arabia&oq=blackwater+saudi+arabia&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l2.6421j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 https://www.google.com/search?q=blackwater+saudi+arabia&oq=b... He seems to have his hands in a LOT of things. Blackwater alone was a big deal, but the more interesting part is that it got re-organized as Academi and seems like into other companies as well. In short, it was never de facto shut down, or reduced in scope, at all.
- lotsofpulp 8y ago
  And his sister is Betsy Devos, the US Secretary of Education, who is married to Dick Devos, who was CEO of Amway, a multi level marketing firm.
- hd4 8y ago
  It's not really a coincidence that this person's companies are linked to Muslim regions or where there are conflicts in Muslim nations. https://www.economist.com/democracy-in-america/2009/08/06/erik-prince-and-the-last-crusade https://www.economist.com/democracy-in-america/2009/08/06/er... >In an affidavit lodged with a court in Virginia, one of the witnesses said that Mr Prince "views himself as a Christian crusader tasked with eliminating Muslims and the Islamic faith from the globe." The statement continues >To that end, Mr. Prince intentionally deployed to Iraq certain men who shared his vision of Christian supremacy, knowing and wanting these men to take every available opportunity to murder Iraqis. Many of these men used call signs based on the Knights of the Templar, the warriors who fought the Crusades. >Mr. Prince operated his companies in a manner that encouraged and rewarded the destruction of Iraqi life. For example, Mr. Prince's executives would openly speak about going over to Iraq to "lay Hajiis out on cardboard." Going to Iraq to shoot and kill Iraqis was viewed as a sport or game. Mr. Prince's employees openly and consistently used racist and derogatory terms for Iraqis and other Arabs, such as "ragheads" or "hajiis."
  - tivert 8y ago
    If that's his view, he's pretty stupid to operate in China. It isn't very friendly to Christians either: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/25/world/asia/china-christmas-church-crackdown.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/25/world/asia/china-christma...
sremani 8y ago
I am currently reading "Civilian Warrior" by Erik Prince https://www.amazon.com/Civilian-Warriors-Inside-Blackwater-Unsung/dp/B00GRBO9NU/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=erik+prince&qid=1550074912&s=gateway&sr=8-1 https://www.amazon.com/Civilian-Warriors-Inside-Blackwater-U... For those who want to know or understand beyond the headlines and news articles.
- tivert 8y ago
  > I am currently reading "Civilian Warrior" by Erik Prince > For those who want to know or understand beyond the headlines and news articles. Something like that is probably only valuable to understand how Erik Prince conceives of himself. It's highly likely to be a self-serving portrayal, so I don't think it's a great help for someone who wants to "know or understand beyond the headlines and news articles." It's more like something a historian could use to mine unindented admissions and small facts that only become valuable when carefully combined with other sources.
- rchaud 8y ago
  What's your take on it? Given the secrecy around this type of work, I would assume that a book written by a guy neck-deep in this would provide as much objectivity as a presidential candidate's autobiography.

72 points by seagullz 8y ago

This is capitalism. Anyone surprised? "Let money talk, nobody cares about the ethics" - Facebook employee on blind

The immediate shutdown of FBI’s war crimes unit is easier to understand under the light of these type revelations. Mercenaries, Saudis and others have incentive to lobby for shutdown because the unit is a threat to the individuals within the United State who may have committed these types of crimes.

pcbro141 8y ago
Additionally, Erik Prince (ex-Blackwater chief) held informal roles in the Trump transition team, establishing channels with various foreign governments (including clients of his). He has also been an informal advisor to the White House. His sister is also Secretary of Education Betsy DeVos.

walrus01 8y ago

Many previous articles in the nytimes: https://www.google.ca/search?q=nytimes+xinjiang https://www.google.ca/search?q=nytimes+xinjiang Let's not forget that a member of the UN security council is apparently running prison camps for an ethnic/religious minority. Foreign journalists are severely restricted from working in Xinjiang.

skytayloriii 8y ago
> a member of the UN security council is apparently running prison camps for an ethnic/religious minority. You can say the name China lol China isn't scary like voldemort. In fact, China is a paper tiger desperately trying to oppress its citizens because its economy is collapsing. China's import fell 10% in january, and expect to drop 20% in february. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-trade/china-january-exports-imports-seen-falling-again-in-blow-to-global-growth-reuters-poll-idUSKCN1Q10D5 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-trade/china.... It is in a long term decline, says morgan stanley, as it will have a account deficit not seen since 1993. https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/13/china-economy-morgan-stanley-predicts-chinas-account-deficit-in-2019.html https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/13/china-economy-morgan-stanley.... Home sales in January declined 56%! across 14 major cities https://www.scmp.com/property/hong-kong-china/article/2185836/china-new-home-sales-decline-56-cent-during-lunar-new-year https://www.scmp.com/property/hong-kong-china/article/218583... Chinese firms are suffering from a wave of default. The government is propping up state firms and squeezing profits out of the private firms. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-debt/debt-guarantee-tangle-chinas-private-firms-hit-by-default-contagion-idUSKCN1Q107W https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-debt/debt-g... It will continue its internal oppression because it has no chance of winning any war against the West or any of its neighbors. However, perhaps after some building up of its navy and airforce in a few years, it will think it has a shot.
- plink 8y ago
  Your Voldemort reference was genuinely hilarious. It also evokes a real unnameableness embedded in this subject: that US courts have determined it slanderous to speak the term "ponzi" in describing the DeVos family's great American fortune.
  - WillPostForFood 8y ago
    US courts have determined it slanderous to speak the term "ponzi" in describing the DeVos family's great American fortune Do you have a citation for that? People criticize Amway as a pyramid or Ponzi scheme all the time.
    - plink 8y ago
      Touché! Such a citation would help elevate my post out of the realm of mere glibness. I must apologize, though, that it wasn’t a court case but an FTC decision: https://www.ftc.gov/sites/default/files/documents/commission_decision_volumes/volume-93/ftc_volume_decision_93_january_-_june_1979pages_618-738.pdf https://www.ftc.gov/sites/default/files/documents/commission... On a related point, I am unable to prove, owing to the destruction of many DeVos family documents in the Great Fire of Massachusetts’s port town of Innsmouth, that Betsy DeVos’s real maiden name is humanly unpronounceable and that the Blackwater Company is a cryptic nod to Lake R’lyeh.

ohaideredevs 8y ago

If anyone is interested, Erik Prince is also in Saudi Arabia: https://www.google.com/search?q=blackwater+saudi+arabia&oq=blackwater+saudi+arabia&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l2.6421j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 https://www.google.com/search?q=blackwater+saudi+arabia&oq=b... He seems to have his hands in a LOT of things. Blackwater alone was a big deal, but the more interesting part is that it got re-organized as Academi and seems like into other companies as well. In short, it was never de facto shut down, or reduced in scope, at all.

lotsofpulp 8y ago
And his sister is Betsy Devos, the US Secretary of Education, who is married to Dick Devos, who was CEO of Amway, a multi level marketing firm.
hd4 8y ago
It's not really a coincidence that this person's companies are linked to Muslim regions or where there are conflicts in Muslim nations. https://www.economist.com/democracy-in-america/2009/08/06/erik-prince-and-the-last-crusade https://www.economist.com/democracy-in-america/2009/08/06/er... >In an affidavit lodged with a court in Virginia, one of the witnesses said that Mr Prince "views himself as a Christian crusader tasked with eliminating Muslims and the Islamic faith from the globe." The statement continues >To that end, Mr. Prince intentionally deployed to Iraq certain men who shared his vision of Christian supremacy, knowing and wanting these men to take every available opportunity to murder Iraqis. Many of these men used call signs based on the Knights of the Templar, the warriors who fought the Crusades. >Mr. Prince operated his companies in a manner that encouraged and rewarded the destruction of Iraqi life. For example, Mr. Prince's executives would openly speak about going over to Iraq to "lay Hajiis out on cardboard." Going to Iraq to shoot and kill Iraqis was viewed as a sport or game. Mr. Prince's employees openly and consistently used racist and derogatory terms for Iraqis and other Arabs, such as "ragheads" or "hajiis."
- tivert 8y ago
  If that's his view, he's pretty stupid to operate in China. It isn't very friendly to Christians either: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/25/world/asia/china-christmas-church-crackdown.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/25/world/asia/china-christma...

sremani 8y ago

I am currently reading "Civilian Warrior" by Erik Prince https://www.amazon.com/Civilian-Warriors-Inside-Blackwater-Unsung/dp/B00GRBO9NU/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=erik+prince&qid=1550074912&s=gateway&sr=8-1 https://www.amazon.com/Civilian-Warriors-Inside-Blackwater-U... For those who want to know or understand beyond the headlines and news articles.

tivert 8y ago
> I am currently reading "Civilian Warrior" by Erik Prince > For those who want to know or understand beyond the headlines and news articles. Something like that is probably only valuable to understand how Erik Prince conceives of himself. It's highly likely to be a self-serving portrayal, so I don't think it's a great help for someone who wants to "know or understand beyond the headlines and news articles." It's more like something a historian could use to mine unindented admissions and small facts that only become valuable when carefully combined with other sources.
rchaud 8y ago
What's your take on it? Given the secrecy around this type of work, I would assume that a book written by a guy neck-deep in this would provide as much objectivity as a presidential candidate's autobiography.