4 ms·

I don't think acting, directing, scoring, or cinematography have changed all that much with the advent of computers. But the computer industry? There are seve

by spc476 8y ago

I don't think acting, directing, scoring, or cinematography have changed all that much with the advent of computers. But the computer industry? There are several languages very popular today that didn't exist when I was in college---heck, try even 10 years ago. So, what must one know to join a "programmers' union"? Or what can a company expect from a "unionized programmer"?

saghm 8y ago
> There are several languages very popular today that didn't exist when I was in college---heck, try even 10 years ago. Honest question: how many of them are used in game development? My limited understanding is that the majority of games still use more traditional languages like C++ and Java.
- mc32 8y ago
  Even better. We’ll get to see how a union gets to affect an industry, whether symbiotically or parasitically. Remains to be seen, but if they affect a slower industry measurably and negatively, then we can have some confidence that in even faster technology sectors the effect would be greater. If they have a positive influence, they could possibly add to a faster paced industry, perhaps. I would love to see a unionized AWS -the whole org., from top to bottom. Then see if MS or Goog would approve,
- spc476 8y ago
  Java wasn't a thing at all when I was in college. C++ was just a few years old at the time. Assembly language was still heavily used, with C becoming popular for game development.
  - spc476 8y ago
    Interesting. For a factual reply (college from 1987 to 1994) there seems to be quite the hate ...
- alasdair_ 8y ago
  Unity is c# And the c++ of a decade ago is quite different from today.
maxsilver 8y ago
> Or what can a company expect from a "unionized programmer"? The same thing they already expect from a non-unionized programmer? Why would anyone expect anything different? Should a hospital expect something different from a "unionized Nurse" instead of a "non-unionized Nurse?"
- alasdair_ 8y ago
  >Should a hospital expect something different from a "unionized Nurse" instead of a "non-unionized Nurse?" While nursing certainly chanes over time and is a difficult job, a good nurse from a decade ago could likely get up to speed within a week or so. Given the pace of change in coding, I don’t think ai could say the same for a decade younger version of myself.
  - swish_bob 8y ago
    You make it sound like you don't know a lot about medicine here. A good nurse who's been out of the field for 10 years will eventually get back up to date, but it's not going to be in a week. Or even a month. A lot of nursing is about understanding the meds you're dealing with. Also, I contend a good programmer who's been out for 10 years still has the ability to be a good programmer. Sure, they're not going to know whatever language/framework is popular this week, and they'll probably be slower to pick up a new one than somebody who's up to date, but I contend they'll be productive in less than a month.
egypturnash 8y ago
Editing's changed, you can try a lot more crazy things a lot faster with Final Cut/Premiere/etc then when you had to cut apart film and tape it together. Scoring's changed, you can simulate a whole orchestra right there in your laptop long before committing to hiring an actual one. Or you can do any of the many things that has changed music since samplers started becoming affordable in the eighties. Also editing's easier. Acting's changed, what used to always involve getting together in the same place with everyone else in a scene can now just involve hanging out on a green screen stage, pretending that a crude puppet standin is the other person in the scene. Or you might be wearing a motion capture rig that'll be used as the basis for a photoreal animated character who'll end up being composited into the shot over you. Animation's changed, now you're as much a technician as an artist, you may be expected to pick up a new software package for a new production. Personally I left the animation industry in part because it looked like all my future gigs were likely to be on a software package I kinda loathed. Directing's changed, you need to be aware of all these possibilites, maybe you decide to not use most of them, but if you do, you get to talk with the people who know them in more detail and figure out how to use all this power.
- Animats 8y ago
  Directing has changed, too. I used to know a B-list Hollywood director. Directors used to come from a theater background. Theatrical directors make a script work by walking through it on a bare stage and making changes until it works. This doesn't work in films with lots of effects. If you try that on an effects film, you go way over budget. Which has happened more than once. Big movies are now waterfall projects - everything is preplanned. As one ILM guy said, a Star Wars movie is three years of preproduction, three months of principal photography, and three years of postproduction. Movie directors now are more like animation directors - they storyboard, they plan, they previsualize, they have a full previz version created, and only then do they get the green light for full production. Upper management gets to see all this work, so there's more interference from above.

by spc476 8y ago

saghm 8y ago

> There are several languages very popular today that didn't exist when I was in college---heck, try even 10 years ago. Honest question: how many of them are used in game development? My limited understanding is that the majority of games still use more traditional languages like C++ and Java.

mc32 8y ago
Even better. We’ll get to see how a union gets to affect an industry, whether symbiotically or parasitically. Remains to be seen, but if they affect a slower industry measurably and negatively, then we can have some confidence that in even faster technology sectors the effect would be greater. If they have a positive influence, they could possibly add to a faster paced industry, perhaps. I would love to see a unionized AWS -the whole org., from top to bottom. Then see if MS or Goog would approve,
spc476 8y ago
Java wasn't a thing at all when I was in college. C++ was just a few years old at the time. Assembly language was still heavily used, with C becoming popular for game development.
- spc476 8y ago
  Interesting. For a factual reply (college from 1987 to 1994) there seems to be quite the hate ...
alasdair_ 8y ago
Unity is c# And the c++ of a decade ago is quite different from today.

maxsilver 8y ago

> Or what can a company expect from a "unionized programmer"? The same thing they already expect from a non-unionized programmer? Why would anyone expect anything different? Should a hospital expect something different from a "unionized Nurse" instead of a "non-unionized Nurse?"

alasdair_ 8y ago
>Should a hospital expect something different from a "unionized Nurse" instead of a "non-unionized Nurse?" While nursing certainly chanes over time and is a difficult job, a good nurse from a decade ago could likely get up to speed within a week or so. Given the pace of change in coding, I don’t think ai could say the same for a decade younger version of myself.
- swish_bob 8y ago
  You make it sound like you don't know a lot about medicine here. A good nurse who's been out of the field for 10 years will eventually get back up to date, but it's not going to be in a week. Or even a month. A lot of nursing is about understanding the meds you're dealing with. Also, I contend a good programmer who's been out for 10 years still has the ability to be a good programmer. Sure, they're not going to know whatever language/framework is popular this week, and they'll probably be slower to pick up a new one than somebody who's up to date, but I contend they'll be productive in less than a month.

egypturnash 8y ago

Editing's changed, you can try a lot more crazy things a lot faster with Final Cut/Premiere/etc then when you had to cut apart film and tape it together. Scoring's changed, you can simulate a whole orchestra right there in your laptop long before committing to hiring an actual one. Or you can do any of the many things that has changed music since samplers started becoming affordable in the eighties. Also editing's easier. Acting's changed, what used to always involve getting together in the same place with everyone else in a scene can now just involve hanging out on a green screen stage, pretending that a crude puppet standin is the other person in the scene. Or you might be wearing a motion capture rig that'll be used as the basis for a photoreal animated character who'll end up being composited into the shot over you. Animation's changed, now you're as much a technician as an artist, you may be expected to pick up a new software package for a new production. Personally I left the animation industry in part because it looked like all my future gigs were likely to be on a software package I kinda loathed. Directing's changed, you need to be aware of all these possibilites, maybe you decide to not use most of them, but if you do, you get to talk with the people who know them in more detail and figure out how to use all this power.

Animats 8y ago
Directing has changed, too. I used to know a B-list Hollywood director. Directors used to come from a theater background. Theatrical directors make a script work by walking through it on a bare stage and making changes until it works. This doesn't work in films with lots of effects. If you try that on an effects film, you go way over budget. Which has happened more than once. Big movies are now waterfall projects - everything is preplanned. As one ILM guy said, a Star Wars movie is three years of preproduction, three months of principal photography, and three years of postproduction. Movie directors now are more like animation directors - they storyboard, they plan, they previsualize, they have a full previz version created, and only then do they get the green light for full production. Upper management gets to see all this work, so there's more interference from above.