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Quit expecting governments to save you. The easiest fix for this problem is to stop using these products! No matter how much bad news comes out about Facebook,
by mimixco 8y ago
Quit expecting governments to save you. The easiest fix for this problem is to stop using these products! No matter how much bad news comes out about Facebook, Apple, Google, and Amazon using your data in bad ways -- people still keep using them. If enough people quit, this will stop or a competitor will rise up who doesn't do this stuff.
- Mirioron 8y agoWe should also demand for more control over what data our browsers send out.
- crooked-v 8y ago"Let the invisible hand of the market fix it" is not something that has a history of actually working on near-monopoly actors.
- maxxxxx 8y agoHow do you even know who does bad stuff?
- crooked-v 8y agoWell, see, you just have to thoroughly investigate holding companies, paywalled court filings, online security breach notices, and legal documentation conveniently available on the other side of the country in a locked filing cabinet in the unlit second subbasement, and do it every time you buy groceries, pay for gas, receive a shipped gift, or spend time in the vicinity of anyone who takes photos with the Facebook app. I don't see what makes it so difficult.
- mimixco 8y agoMonopolies have to be propped-up by governments. No monopoly can survive in a truly free market. Never has; never will. Power companies, cable companies, and telco operators are all monopolies propped up by government. An actually free market will always eliminate them when some competitor rises up with a lower cost, a better product, or better service. There has never in history been a monopoly company that could operate in a free market without government support.
- maxxxxx 8y agoMost people don’t know about these issues or don’t care. Also how do you know what company uses your data in bad ways? There are probably plenty of others who do shady stuff you never hear about. We need privacy laws so products that are on the market can be safely used. Otherwise let’s abolish food safety rules and tell people just not to eat at places where food with salmonella gets sold.
- donatj 8y agoI think comparing food safety to data safety is comparing unlike types and levels of safety. No one has ever died from targeted advertising.
- maxxxxx 8y agoIt's the same thing in the sense that the customer can't really tell upfront which service is safe.
- gpderetta 8y agoYes I'm sure targeted advertising is the worst thing that can happen from mass profiling.
- Ezhik 8y ago>No one has ever died from targeted advertising. https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/7/16257412/rehabs-near-me-google-search-scam-florida-treatment-centers https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/7/16257412/rehabs-near-me-go... Targeted advertising can be and is used to target people at their most vulnerable. There almost certainly is a death toll.
- mimixco 8y agoIf you have a Facebook account, you know their using your data in bad ways. If you don't know that already, that's on you. As I've said before and will say again, a social network is not a human necessity nor a right. Delete your account and watch these problems go away in a flash.
- 8y ago
- anonymousab 8y agoGovernments are one lever through which society enacts changes upon itself. They are made up of the people themselves, after all. It's no less valid than other ways for people to collectively pool influence to enact change (i.e. boycotts or forming other types of organizations).
- mimixco 8y agoGovernments are not made up of people; they're made of politicians. The most powerful dynamic in the marketplace is purchasing power. If you don't like something, quit using it and the company will eventually fold (most likely) or morph into something people want (far less likely).
- vjeux 8y agoFor the Equifax breach, most of the people affected didn’t have any direct relationship with Equifax. So this advice wouldn’t apply in that case.
- mnm1 8y agoNonsense. Can you provide a way I can get Equifax and similar companies to stop stealing and selling my data? I've been trying to do that for decades. No. Your argument is bullshit. I didn't sign up for this shit and neither did anyone else, yet we still got fucked. How do you propose we fix it now? The cellular companies are still selling my data. Should I not own a cell phone because I can't get a cell plan that won't steal and sell my data? The ISPs are selling my data. Should I not have an Internet connection? Yes, I can get rid of those, lose my job, be homeless and starve while I wait for the idiot masses to do the same so maybe a competitor could rise up. That's your brilliant solution. And it still doesn't deal with the fact that companies I didn't sign up with are stealing and selling my data.
- simplecomplex 8y agoEquifax is a credit reporting agency. So, for example, someone gets a loan from a bank, then fails to pay it and the bank reports that to them. Other lenders check with them before lending to people. You’re being disingenuous by equating that with theft.
- mnm1 8y agoNot patching servers for months and leaving them for attackers to exploit is definitely stealing. It doesn't matter how they got the data, they let others steal it and were therefore complicit in the theft itself due to negligence, willful or not.
- simplecomplex 8y agoYeah, they didn’t steal your data. They were negligent with storing data on you given to them by lenders, and if you can demonstrate you were actually damaged by their negligence you can join the class action that’s happening. You should have got an email about it. I know I did.
- mimixco 8y agoYou can get out of the credit game. You can use a cell phone without a Google account, or buy one of the new open source ones coming to market. No one needs a social network like FB. Just stop using it and they will go away.
- foobandit 8y agoThis isn't going to happen while the problems are still theoretical. Few people care if companies have their data as long as it isn't used against them.
- 908087 8y agoThese companies collect that data specifically to use it against you for their own financial gain.
- olefoo 8y agoI too wish I had the resources to go live in the woods and not deal with the modern world.
- xorgar831 8y agoOr if we all get together and decide a company shouldn't behave in a certain way, that's another option. We call that government regulation when we everyone gets together to do that. You can think of it as voting with your money, just without the money part.
- mimixco 8y agoGovernments have never consisted of "everyone getting together." That's a myth that smacks of socialism. The best way to get the products and services you want (and wipe out the ones you don't) is to vote with your pocketbook. With Facebook and other "free" services, you are the product -- not the customer. Stopping this is very simple; just don't agree to be the product anymore. No one needs a social network. There isn't one compelling reason for anyone to join one unless you are a shareholder. You don't need the government to protect you from social networks or fix their ills. You need to delete your account and take personal responsibility for your complicity.
- dragonwriter 8y ago> With Facebook and other "free" services, you are the product No, you are a supplier of a key input to the product.
- mimixco 8y agoNo, sir. You are the product to be bought and sold on the free market and that's how they treat you. FB's software is free and therefore not the product. Your personal information is what's commercially valuable and therefore is the product. Google operates on the same model and you can quit that, too, if you'd like. If you don't, that's on you. Don't ask government to save you from this when you can delete your FB account by yourself and get out of the game. There isn't one personal or commercial benefit to FB or other social networks which has not already been solved by other technologies.
- dllthomas 8y ago
- gpderetta 8y agoExactly! For example I have hired a food taster to try my food, and I'm currently looking for someone willing to be a guinea pig next time I interview a bunch of surgeons for a job. Of course I had the engineers stand under the bridge while my army was marching across.
- fzeroracer 8y agoFacebook collects data on people that never even use or touch or go near facebook. How exactly do you stop using their product?
- mimixco 8y agoLots of companies that you've never used collect data on you. Look at the amount of junk mail you receive from people you've never done business with, and all of them have data on you. This part isn't fixable. But by having an FB account and actively using the service, you become part of the problem. FB would not have nearly the market value that they do if no one used their product. Actually, they would have zero value. Is there something in your life that requires FB so badly that you're willing to continue being their product? No, there isn't. You can still phone your friends. You can still text your family. There are plenty of other methods of communication without FB. FB is not a communications tool, though they pitch themselves that way. They are a data gathering and advertising tool. If you agree to be part of that, that's on you.
- sonnyblarney 8y ago"Quit expecting governments to save you. The easiest fix for this problem is to stop using these products! " No, this is why we have regulations for cars, food, and everything else. Free markets don't work well in most of these areas because information can't flow properly. If it did, markets might work quite well. But they don't, and players cheat, so we need regulations.
- mimixco 8y agoIt might surprise you to learn that governments actually support monopolies and encourage them. A monopoly cannot exist in a true free market and has never done so in history.
- uberman 8y agoYou can't stop using Equifax, Experian, or Trans Union. While it is likely you can stop using Target, there are plenty of other retailers who have been the subject of data breaches. Here is just a partial list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_data_breaches https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_data_breaches When these companies have data breaches and loose your credit data into the public they should pay a real price. At the moment their penalty is offering you "a years worth of credit monitoring". There is virtually no accountability for protecting this data yet your credit profile is used extensively for everything from getting a load, to rending an apartment, security and background checks.
- mimixco 8y agoStop borrowing money on credit cards. Live within your means and it won't matter what any credit card company thinks of you. Here again, personal responsibility trumps government salvation every time.