5 ms·

We really need tech monopolies like Google to be regulated, in order to stop abuses like this.

by Melchizedek 8y ago

sandworm101 8y ago
No. They need to be broken apart so they arent so vital individually.
- Pharmakon 8y ago
  Regulation and anti-trust action are not mutually exclusive.
morpheuskafka 8y ago
Google Play is not a monopoly! It takes one checkbox in Settings to open the floodgates to any app (or app store) you want, and device manufacturers (such as Amazon) can ship their own app stores pre-enabled if they want.
- yjftsjthsd-h 8y ago
  What percentage of android devices, in the world, have that box ticked?
  - Natanael_L 8y ago
    Enough for Fortnite to get players on Android
  - slrz 8y ago
    I'd guess most of them, if you actually consider the whole world. Probably not enough to matter, if you are only looking at the UK.
    - yjftsjthsd-h 8y ago
      Oh, good point. I forgot about China.
    - efreak 8y ago
      Actually, alternative app stores can make use of that as well. The installer app needs to be installed as a system app with proper permissions, and it will them be able to background install apps on demand just like Google play does. The F-Droid Privileged Extension[0] does just that. While you need to be rooted to add/register such apps, that's not a problem for device manufacturers. [0] https://gitlab.com/fdroid/privileged-extension/ https://gitlab.com/fdroid/privileged-extension/
      - zifnab06 8y ago
        As of Oreo Google doesn't allow this for devices if they're to pass CTS without users jumping through multiple hoops first.
  - morpheuskafka 8y ago
    If you open an APK it prompts you to go right to Settings and enable it. Actually easier than installing Firefox on a brand new Windows Surface, which requires an MS account to enable unknown app sources.
- staz 8y ago
  Correct me if I'm wrong but it's seem that technically 3rd party store can't do unattended upgrade while Google Play can.
- AlfeG 8y ago
  Its actually no more single button. A button per apk source
denniskane 8y ago
The problem with this starts with the word "we". How do, for lack of a better word, "we" get some kind of authentic sense of we-ness going in this modern age of increasing social atomization? Here's how I do it... when I'm not busy hacking away on the next generation of (potentially planet saving) general computation[1], I am performing my solemn duties in the real world as "the peace guy"[2]. [1] See: https://linuxontheweb.org/desk.os https://linuxontheweb.org/desk.os [2] https://www.google.com/search?q=the+peace+guy https://www.google.com/search?q=the+peace+guy
avip 8y ago
Google is regulated in many ways. It just got the fattest antitrust fine in EU history (read all about it https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17556497 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17556497).
int_19h 8y ago
They're regulated. The problem is that our threshold for bad monopolistic behavior is that customers suffer, and it can be damn hard to prove when it's indirect, like in this case - how much do customers suffer from not having access to the app in question? But even then, when you aggregate all that across the entire store, I'd say that there's that aspect as well. Back when our anti-monopoly legislation was first introduced, that wasn't the case - monopolies were busted just as well because they did something anti-competitive, even if that was presented as benefiting their customers (and even if it really did, short term). https://ir.lawnet.fordham.edu/flr/vol81/iss5/6/ https://ir.lawnet.fordham.edu/flr/vol81/iss5/6/
sneak 8y ago
Why is it an abuse for Google to arbitrarily deny you access to Google’s website? Everyone has the right to revoke consent at any time. Additionally, why do you believe Google is a monopoly, and in which line of business?
megaman8 8y ago
Regulation isn't a silver bullet. Maybe a little bit for certain things. But, You'll never be able to develop enough rules to make sure everyone is treated fairly. the best way out of this is to educate users and start getting them to use other search products. we need more diversity of choice.

We really need tech monopolies like Google to be regulated, in order to stop abuses like this.

sandworm101 8y ago

No. They need to be broken apart so they arent so vital individually.

Pharmakon 8y ago
Regulation and anti-trust action are not mutually exclusive.

morpheuskafka 8y ago

Google Play is not a monopoly! It takes one checkbox in Settings to open the floodgates to any app (or app store) you want, and device manufacturers (such as Amazon) can ship their own app stores pre-enabled if they want.

yjftsjthsd-h 8y ago
What percentage of android devices, in the world, have that box ticked?
- Natanael_L 8y ago
  Enough for Fortnite to get players on Android
- slrz 8y ago
  I'd guess most of them, if you actually consider the whole world. Probably not enough to matter, if you are only looking at the UK.
  - yjftsjthsd-h 8y ago
    Oh, good point. I forgot about China.
  - efreak 8y ago
    Actually, alternative app stores can make use of that as well. The installer app needs to be installed as a system app with proper permissions, and it will them be able to background install apps on demand just like Google play does. The F-Droid Privileged Extension[0] does just that. While you need to be rooted to add/register such apps, that's not a problem for device manufacturers. [0] https://gitlab.com/fdroid/privileged-extension/ https://gitlab.com/fdroid/privileged-extension/
    - zifnab06 8y ago
      As of Oreo Google doesn't allow this for devices if they're to pass CTS without users jumping through multiple hoops first.
- morpheuskafka 8y ago
  If you open an APK it prompts you to go right to Settings and enable it. Actually easier than installing Firefox on a brand new Windows Surface, which requires an MS account to enable unknown app sources.
staz 8y ago
Correct me if I'm wrong but it's seem that technically 3rd party store can't do unattended upgrade while Google Play can.
AlfeG 8y ago
Its actually no more single button. A button per apk source

denniskane 8y ago

The problem with this starts with the word "we". How do, for lack of a better word, "we" get some kind of authentic sense of we-ness going in this modern age of increasing social atomization? Here's how I do it... when I'm not busy hacking away on the next generation of (potentially planet saving) general computation[1], I am performing my solemn duties in the real world as "the peace guy"[2]. [1] See: https://linuxontheweb.org/desk.os https://linuxontheweb.org/desk.os [2] https://www.google.com/search?q=the+peace+guy https://www.google.com/search?q=the+peace+guy

avip 8y ago

Google is regulated in many ways. It just got the fattest antitrust fine in EU history (read all about it https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17556497 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17556497).

int_19h 8y ago

They're regulated. The problem is that our threshold for bad monopolistic behavior is that customers suffer, and it can be damn hard to prove when it's indirect, like in this case - how much do customers suffer from not having access to the app in question? But even then, when you aggregate all that across the entire store, I'd say that there's that aspect as well. Back when our anti-monopoly legislation was first introduced, that wasn't the case - monopolies were busted just as well because they did something anti-competitive, even if that was presented as benefiting their customers (and even if it really did, short term). https://ir.lawnet.fordham.edu/flr/vol81/iss5/6/ https://ir.lawnet.fordham.edu/flr/vol81/iss5/6/

sneak 8y ago

Why is it an abuse for Google to arbitrarily deny you access to Google’s website? Everyone has the right to revoke consent at any time. Additionally, why do you believe Google is a monopoly, and in which line of business?

megaman8 8y ago

Regulation isn't a silver bullet. Maybe a little bit for certain things. But, You'll never be able to develop enough rules to make sure everyone is treated fairly. the best way out of this is to educate users and start getting them to use other search products. we need more diversity of choice.