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Disagree. Google isn't responsible for the content of emails, WhatsApp is not responsible for the groups using it to organize, and the monuments in D.C. aren't

Disagree. Google isn't responsible for the content of emails, WhatsApp is not responsible for the groups using it to organize, and the monuments in D.C. aren't responsible when some folks decide to yell bigoted language. There needs to be room for public spaces to just be venues. Service providers should be able to just be service providers. There should be limits, but they should mostly align with legal limits and they should be enforce by law enforcement officers accountable to the public primarily by observing public posts or through warrants and subpoenas. There should additionally be norms about, broadly, what counts as disruptive behavior, but it needs to be agnostic about content. I don't really care if it is hard to make 100 billion dollars because there are too many trolls or because the content doesn't align with "corporate values".

ajross 8y ago
Again, though, that's what you say you want, but it's not what you want. You want moderation, you want focused discussion, you want to be free of objectionable garbage, you want high signal to noise ratio, and the proof of that is that you're having this argument on a heavily moderated discussion forum as we speak. There's no lack of "true" free speech opportunity on the internet. Sites like stormfront and 4chan remain a thing. Don't pretend like that's what we all want from Reddit, is all I'm saying.
- humanrebar 8y ago
  I don't want the government to hold platforms accountable for user generated content. I want private organizations to choose between being objective platforms like libraries or subjective organizations with a voice like The Washington Post. And I want norms, not laws, to enforce that distinction. I don't want jerks interrupting my conversations with spam, but that's a very different matter than censoring people's thoughts because I don't agree or have unpleasant emotions when exposed to them. I think HN is overmoderated, for what it's worth. It used to be more interesting but its habit of dinging threads with lots of discussion has a habit of filtering out important discussion in addition to heated discussion. I definitely don't hold HN accountable for what random people post here.
  - amanaplanacanal 8y ago
    I certainly see some people saying they want unmoderated forums, but they seem to be a pretty small minority. It sounds like you have a pretty good idea of what kind of moderation you are looking for. Have you found a forum that is aligned with that?

ajross 8y ago

Again, though, that's what you say you want, but it's not what you want. You want moderation, you want focused discussion, you want to be free of objectionable garbage, you want high signal to noise ratio, and the proof of that is that you're having this argument on a heavily moderated discussion forum as we speak. There's no lack of "true" free speech opportunity on the internet. Sites like stormfront and 4chan remain a thing. Don't pretend like that's what we all want from Reddit, is all I'm saying.

humanrebar 8y ago
I don't want the government to hold platforms accountable for user generated content. I want private organizations to choose between being objective platforms like libraries or subjective organizations with a voice like The Washington Post. And I want norms, not laws, to enforce that distinction. I don't want jerks interrupting my conversations with spam, but that's a very different matter than censoring people's thoughts because I don't agree or have unpleasant emotions when exposed to them. I think HN is overmoderated, for what it's worth. It used to be more interesting but its habit of dinging threads with lots of discussion has a habit of filtering out important discussion in addition to heated discussion. I definitely don't hold HN accountable for what random people post here.
- amanaplanacanal 8y ago
  I certainly see some people saying they want unmoderated forums, but they seem to be a pretty small minority. It sounds like you have a pretty good idea of what kind of moderation you are looking for. Have you found a forum that is aligned with that?