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Has there been any exploration of a version of Basic Income in exchange for community service? There's a virtually endless amount of unskilled work that could

by Reedx 8y ago

Has there been any exploration of a version of Basic Income in exchange for community service? There's a virtually endless amount of unskilled work that could be done to improve the environment and people's lives.

spilk 8y ago
Sounds sort of like the New Deal "Civilian Conservation Corps" that built up many of the national park facilities we now enjoy in the USA.
icebraining 8y ago
Paying people in exchange for work is called a job, not UBI.
- snarf21 8y ago
  Kinda except you get to pick any "job" you want, work any amount of hours you want but still know you will get paid exactly the same amount. People might be happier reading to seniors 10 hours a week but not for minimum wage.
  - Wowfunhappy 8y ago
    So how do you determine want amount of community service is necessary? Does picking up one piece of trash off the sidewalk count as community service? As soon as you tie the payment to a certain type of task, you have to enforce a standard of time/quality.
Datenstrom 8y ago
I think this is a great idea. I have also been pitching it in conversations with people who oppose UBI for years and it is generally very well received by them. Unfortunately I am unaware if this has actually been implemented anywhere.
- mmmmmmmmm 8y ago
  It's well-received because it's not actually UBI. It's just a job. The government already employs millions of people. You're pitching something that is already implemented, but pretending like you just invented it. Congratulations, you're Juicero.
tracker1 8y ago
I think it'd be a great idea.. you either are on disability, work an average of at least 20 hours a week at a paid, taxable job (under the table work won't count), or you volunteer for registered services programs for 20 hours a week. 20 hours a week is just my suggestion as a minimum that would allow for people to still job search if they choose to and could be averaged over a quarter or year or similar. Exceptions would be for those who would traditionally be on Medicare. Note: I think if UBI were implemented that Medicare and a lot of other programs should be replaced by it.
- lazyasciiart 8y ago
  Most of the discussions of UBI are amounts too small to cover e.g chemotherapy. Or are you picturing a collapse in prices of healthcare as well?
  - tracker1 8y ago
    Again, I'm not talking about touching medicaid, I'm also not talking about any specific limits for given age brackets. Only suggesting that any such new organization should fold in one or more existing organizations.
- fucking_tragedy 8y ago
  > Note: I think if UBI were implemented that Medicare and a lot of other programs should be replaced by it. Medicare is a program that solely exists for the retired who over 65 and disabled people. Medicaid, on the other hand, is available to those who live in states that accepted federal funding via the ACA and are within a certain percentage of the federal poverty line. Those who don't qualify for Medicaid, but are under a certain income level, have their health insurance premiums subsidized via the ACA. If you plan on eliminating Medicaid, you'll need to acknowledge the fact that even people who earn many multiples of the federal poverty level are still eligible for subsidized health insurance due to burden of costs. If people who are not poor by federal standards need to have their health insurance costs subsidized, that means people whose income is derived from UBI-esque make-work programs will have a hard time affording health insurance if they're considered eligible for Medicaid, but it was eliminated. This is why many proponents see UBI as an adjunct, not a replacement, for existing programs.
simonsarris 8y ago
I have proposed something similar here: https://medium.com/s/free-money/guaranteed-minimum-agriculture-f93a5aa38c97 https://medium.com/s/free-money/guaranteed-minimum-agricultu... (I use agriculture as the catchy example because almost every community could use some amount of it, but it goes well beyond that)

by Reedx 8y ago

spilk 8y ago

Sounds sort of like the New Deal "Civilian Conservation Corps" that built up many of the national park facilities we now enjoy in the USA.

icebraining 8y ago

Paying people in exchange for work is called a job, not UBI.

snarf21 8y ago
Kinda except you get to pick any "job" you want, work any amount of hours you want but still know you will get paid exactly the same amount. People might be happier reading to seniors 10 hours a week but not for minimum wage.
- Wowfunhappy 8y ago
  So how do you determine want amount of community service is necessary? Does picking up one piece of trash off the sidewalk count as community service? As soon as you tie the payment to a certain type of task, you have to enforce a standard of time/quality.

Datenstrom 8y ago

I think this is a great idea. I have also been pitching it in conversations with people who oppose UBI for years and it is generally very well received by them. Unfortunately I am unaware if this has actually been implemented anywhere.

mmmmmmmmm 8y ago
It's well-received because it's not actually UBI. It's just a job. The government already employs millions of people. You're pitching something that is already implemented, but pretending like you just invented it. Congratulations, you're Juicero.

tracker1 8y ago

I think it'd be a great idea.. you either are on disability, work an average of at least 20 hours a week at a paid, taxable job (under the table work won't count), or you volunteer for registered services programs for 20 hours a week. 20 hours a week is just my suggestion as a minimum that would allow for people to still job search if they choose to and could be averaged over a quarter or year or similar. Exceptions would be for those who would traditionally be on Medicare. Note: I think if UBI were implemented that Medicare and a lot of other programs should be replaced by it.

lazyasciiart 8y ago
Most of the discussions of UBI are amounts too small to cover e.g chemotherapy. Or are you picturing a collapse in prices of healthcare as well?
- tracker1 8y ago
  Again, I'm not talking about touching medicaid, I'm also not talking about any specific limits for given age brackets. Only suggesting that any such new organization should fold in one or more existing organizations.
fucking_tragedy 8y ago
> Note: I think if UBI were implemented that Medicare and a lot of other programs should be replaced by it. Medicare is a program that solely exists for the retired who over 65 and disabled people. Medicaid, on the other hand, is available to those who live in states that accepted federal funding via the ACA and are within a certain percentage of the federal poverty line. Those who don't qualify for Medicaid, but are under a certain income level, have their health insurance premiums subsidized via the ACA. If you plan on eliminating Medicaid, you'll need to acknowledge the fact that even people who earn many multiples of the federal poverty level are still eligible for subsidized health insurance due to burden of costs. If people who are not poor by federal standards need to have their health insurance costs subsidized, that means people whose income is derived from UBI-esque make-work programs will have a hard time affording health insurance if they're considered eligible for Medicaid, but it was eliminated. This is why many proponents see UBI as an adjunct, not a replacement, for existing programs.

simonsarris 8y ago

I have proposed something similar here: https://medium.com/s/free-money/guaranteed-minimum-agriculture-f93a5aa38c97 https://medium.com/s/free-money/guaranteed-minimum-agricultu... (I use agriculture as the catchy example because almost every community could use some amount of it, but it goes well beyond that)