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Quote: "Living alone was not associated with dying prematurely for those in the highest socioeconomic group — the 19 percent of study participants who had a un

by wenc 8y ago

Quote: "Living alone was not associated with dying prematurely for those in the highest socioeconomic group — the 19 percent of study participants who had a university degree or worked in an executive position. But for the rest, the lower the socioeconomic status, the higher the risk for death. The authors emphasize that the remaining 81 percent of the population was not deprived or living in poverty, but consisted mainly of middle-class and skilled and unskilled workers." Socioeconomic class moderates mortality even among the loners? That's not unexpected. That said, I wonder if Danish society contributes particularly to loneliness. Most happiness studies (a trend in recent years) place Denmark at the top of happiness indices, but my understanding is happiness in this context often doesn't reflect an emotional well-being among individuals, only a quantitative aggregate one. Much has been said about the Danish concept of hygge (cozyness) but Scandinavian life in general is very privatized. I wonder if Danish social connectedness metrics are perhaps not so stellar.

eecc 8y ago
Watch https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Swedish_Theory_of_Love https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Swedish_Theory_of_Love Ok, it’s not precisely the same country but they’re very close
renholder 8y ago
>Most happiness studies (a trend in recent years) place Denmark at the top of happiness indices... I wonder if the "happiness" part is a misnomer and should actually be "contentment". Having experienced the Nordic/Scandinavian cutlures, myself (Sweden), they are pretty private but it's not impossible to have a social life - compared to, say, Ireland. I think the general demeanor of Scandinavians is pretty jovial but this also seems to be geographically-dependent (e.g.: city versus "country"). All of that being said, it's no surprise that the more money you have, the longer you live. I have a suspicion that it is related to the lesser amounts of stressors regarding to any fiscal matters. (Not saying that no one stresses about fiscal matters in that 19% but if it is due to fewer fiscal stressors, then it might be worth noting.) I wonder what the break-down of the cardiovascular health group is...
- wenc 8y ago
  Yes, I agree. I think "contentment" is definitely a much more accurate term. My origins are Canadian and I definitely understand the kind of quiet contentment where most people have all their basic needs met and then some; but living in an extroverted city in America (Chicago) where people are warm and friendly makes me think a substantial segment of the population here are emotionally happier and better connected, even though there's more crime, no free healthcare and fewer social services. The Latino population for instance appear to be somewhat happy and connected even though they have their fair share of struggles. This isn't true of all of the U.S. -- northern states like Minnesota are definitely more austere and introverted. (Minnesota is also strongly Scandinavian)
ajkjk 8y ago
I had a long conversation at a hostel in Denmark with a Danish reporter whose opinion was that the metrics of Denmark as being a happy place are completely misleading, and that modern Danish society was deeply lonely. It's fuzzy because it was a few years ago, but I remember she said that it's common for young Danish people to move to the city when they become adults and completely lose touch with their families, and that social relationships at least in Copenhagen tended to be unfulfilling and superficial. Entirely hearsay. I'd be curious to hear other perspectives. (She was also older than the millennial generation, so may have been out of touch herself.)
- kirstenbirgit 8y ago
  As a Dane, here's some observations: You don't ever talk to strangers. If you do, its superficial, or e.g. something crazy is taking place in a public space you can't avoid commenting on. So if you're not good at striking up conversation or don't look friendly, you'll simply never meet new people. No-one will talk to you unprovoked, ever. Therefore, most Danes are only in a single close-knit group with their friends from school, since it's really the only place where you are forced to meet new people. As a result of this, it's extremely hard to "break in" to a new group of friends if you've for example moved to Denmark from another country or just moved to another city. I suspect most Danes find social gratification through work. We're good at keeping a cosy working culture which involves lots and lots of cake (and alcohol, at parties.) Most Danes I know maybe talk to one or two friends regularly and are totally content with that. Myself, I only regularly talk to my parents and my work mates – the rest have steadily disappeared from my life.
  - mixmastamyk 8y ago
    This is mostly true in Los Angeles as well, you won't make any lasting friends in public. There are ways around it though, e.g. going to meetups of various sorts, taking a dance class, etc. Still have to work hard to get over the hump though.
    - ianai 8y ago
      I blame the 40 hour work week with rigid requirements on time/location. 8-10 hours of a day are basically the entirety of the hours someone has to not be tending to chores and other commitments. This would probably be helped by a UBI.
neonate 8y ago
I wonder if the reason for those survey results is not that the Danes are happiest, but that they complain the least.
Viker 8y ago
Yes if you look at Scandinavian societies in isolation, they are happy people. The type of happiness you can feel for every minute that you do not freeze to death. If we look at Scandinavian societies in comparison to the rest of the world and taking in consideration things like family, social connections, friendships, and general person to person connections, then you end up with a sad sad story. Especially for an outsider living in Scandinavia. Basically one observes a pack of humanoid-like snow people that have a compeletly different value system from the rest of the world. Weak social and family relations, no morals outside of what is legal and not, and the worst of all is that they have the feeling that they are better. A lot can be told about these people by looking at their past. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Jante https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Jante Yes, I do live here and I do believe that "When in Rome...", but this is not Rome, it's like more like a zoo with golden toilets and snow monkeys.
- darkhorn 8y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_shock https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_shock

by wenc 8y ago

eecc 8y ago

Watch https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Swedish_Theory_of_Love https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Swedish_Theory_of_Love Ok, it’s not precisely the same country but they’re very close

renholder 8y ago

>Most happiness studies (a trend in recent years) place Denmark at the top of happiness indices... I wonder if the "happiness" part is a misnomer and should actually be "contentment". Having experienced the Nordic/Scandinavian cutlures, myself (Sweden), they are pretty private but it's not impossible to have a social life - compared to, say, Ireland. I think the general demeanor of Scandinavians is pretty jovial but this also seems to be geographically-dependent (e.g.: city versus "country"). All of that being said, it's no surprise that the more money you have, the longer you live. I have a suspicion that it is related to the lesser amounts of stressors regarding to any fiscal matters. (Not saying that no one stresses about fiscal matters in that 19% but if it is due to fewer fiscal stressors, then it might be worth noting.) I wonder what the break-down of the cardiovascular health group is...

wenc 8y ago
Yes, I agree. I think "contentment" is definitely a much more accurate term. My origins are Canadian and I definitely understand the kind of quiet contentment where most people have all their basic needs met and then some; but living in an extroverted city in America (Chicago) where people are warm and friendly makes me think a substantial segment of the population here are emotionally happier and better connected, even though there's more crime, no free healthcare and fewer social services. The Latino population for instance appear to be somewhat happy and connected even though they have their fair share of struggles. This isn't true of all of the U.S. -- northern states like Minnesota are definitely more austere and introverted. (Minnesota is also strongly Scandinavian)

ajkjk 8y ago

I had a long conversation at a hostel in Denmark with a Danish reporter whose opinion was that the metrics of Denmark as being a happy place are completely misleading, and that modern Danish society was deeply lonely. It's fuzzy because it was a few years ago, but I remember she said that it's common for young Danish people to move to the city when they become adults and completely lose touch with their families, and that social relationships at least in Copenhagen tended to be unfulfilling and superficial. Entirely hearsay. I'd be curious to hear other perspectives. (She was also older than the millennial generation, so may have been out of touch herself.)

kirstenbirgit 8y ago
As a Dane, here's some observations: You don't ever talk to strangers. If you do, its superficial, or e.g. something crazy is taking place in a public space you can't avoid commenting on. So if you're not good at striking up conversation or don't look friendly, you'll simply never meet new people. No-one will talk to you unprovoked, ever. Therefore, most Danes are only in a single close-knit group with their friends from school, since it's really the only place where you are forced to meet new people. As a result of this, it's extremely hard to "break in" to a new group of friends if you've for example moved to Denmark from another country or just moved to another city. I suspect most Danes find social gratification through work. We're good at keeping a cosy working culture which involves lots and lots of cake (and alcohol, at parties.) Most Danes I know maybe talk to one or two friends regularly and are totally content with that. Myself, I only regularly talk to my parents and my work mates – the rest have steadily disappeared from my life.
- mixmastamyk 8y ago
  This is mostly true in Los Angeles as well, you won't make any lasting friends in public. There are ways around it though, e.g. going to meetups of various sorts, taking a dance class, etc. Still have to work hard to get over the hump though.
  - ianai 8y ago
    I blame the 40 hour work week with rigid requirements on time/location. 8-10 hours of a day are basically the entirety of the hours someone has to not be tending to chores and other commitments. This would probably be helped by a UBI.

neonate 8y ago

I wonder if the reason for those survey results is not that the Danes are happiest, but that they complain the least.

Viker 8y ago

Yes if you look at Scandinavian societies in isolation, they are happy people. The type of happiness you can feel for every minute that you do not freeze to death. If we look at Scandinavian societies in comparison to the rest of the world and taking in consideration things like family, social connections, friendships, and general person to person connections, then you end up with a sad sad story. Especially for an outsider living in Scandinavia. Basically one observes a pack of humanoid-like snow people that have a compeletly different value system from the rest of the world. Weak social and family relations, no morals outside of what is legal and not, and the worst of all is that they have the feeling that they are better. A lot can be told about these people by looking at their past. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Jante https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Jante Yes, I do live here and I do believe that "When in Rome...", but this is not Rome, it's like more like a zoo with golden toilets and snow monkeys.

darkhorn 8y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_shock https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_shock