6 ms·

The "RPi is for nerds" shtick is specifically what they're probably trying to get rid of with that store. Looking approachable is a pretty key component of that

The "RPi is for nerds" shtick is specifically what they're probably trying to get rid of with that store. Looking approachable is a pretty key component of that. Doesn't really look like an Apple Store either, unless wood and white is now reserved for Apple...

whywhywhywhy 8y ago
> Looking approachable is a pretty key component of that. Agreed, the other key component though is actually making their machine and software/hardware approachable, smooth, performant and reliable. Which they haven't really put any effort in to since they started. I really wanted the dream of an affordable computer for kids to be a reality but at the end of the day when the $35 just isn't as performant as a budget tablet around the same price then kids are going to just end up with tablets and never have the opportunity to crack the machine open. If the product doesn't live up to the sales pitch of the store, then the product is just going to get returned.
- wolfgke 8y ago
  > I really wanted the dream of an affordable computer for kids to be a reality but at the end of the day when the $35 just isn't as performant as a budget tablet around the same price then kids are going to just end up with tablets and never have the opportunity to crack the machine open. For the children that love to tinker, $€35 will probably not be an obstacle. Tablets and RPis appeal to quite different audiences.
- HeadsUpHigh 8y ago
  Tinkering is not the same as consuming media/games. The kids who play with tablets and the kids who tinker with pis are completely different demographics( or the same person at different times). While I agree that the rpi leaves a lot to be desired( and other boards have left it in the dust hardware-wise) it is still the most accessible board out there and to say that they haven't improved on that is false( especially with software).
  - whywhywhywhy 8y ago
    I totally get that I just think there is a lot of value to the tinkering being possible on the device they use for everything else. How many kids got a PC to play games on but while bored found QBasic and Gorillas.bas. How many kids on MySpace or NeoPets learnt HTML/CSS as a way to customize their profiles. This all used to be a reality when kids grew up using a general purpose computing platform, now the choices are a Tablet that works as a general purpose platform you can't tinker with or a board you can only tinker on but not use as a computer.
    - HeadsUpHigh 8y ago
      I agree. But a tablet is only possible because you can't tinker with it( hardware limitations, how would you fit connectors etc in it?). The software side of things could be better but you also have to keep in mind that an RPi makes both hardware and software tinkering on a very cheap package. Tinkering with software on an old PC was possible but tinkering with hardware would risk a fairly expensive machine.
- fenwick67 8y ago
  If they fixed power (stop using USB micro B, add a power switch header) and SD card stuff (let me boot from USB), I would be so much happier with my pis. But as it stands they are really messy to work with.
  - cbhl 8y ago
    Using USB micro B lowers the BOM while making the device accessible in international markets (regardless of what your local power is, everyone has USB power adapters). Personally, I'd like to USB-C, but USB-C headers are still hella expensive. That being said, you can power a Pi by attaching the right cables to the GPIO headers: https://www.adafruit.com/product/954 https://www.adafruit.com/product/954 https://learn.adafruit.com/adafruits-raspberry-pi-lesson-5-using-a-console-cable/connect-the-lead https://learn.adafruit.com/adafruits-raspberry-pi-lesson-5-u... Booting from USB required a hardware change, and appears to be available in the latest versions of the Pi: https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/hardware/raspberrypi/bootmodes/msd.md https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/hardware/raspberry... (Admittedly, it looks like you need a microSD card to boot the Pi so you can reconfigure it this way.)
    - fenwick67 8y ago
      Wow I truly did not know you could simply boot from USB on the 3+, thanks for that.
eponeponepon 8y ago
unless wood and white is now reserved for Apple... I wouldn't put it past them to try...
bluescrn 8y ago
The RPi is for nerds, so long as we class engineers, scientists, makers and so on as nerds. The non-nerdy masses aren’t interested, they’re happily consuming content on iOS or Android, or doing work on Windows/MacOS
wolfgke 8y ago
> The "RPi is for nerds" shtick is specifically what they're probably trying to get rid of with that store. Companies should be very careful not to alienate their core audience that made them big. In the past, lots of companies in their plans to widen their audiences made this mistake.
- folkrav 8y ago
  I fail to see how having a clean looking store alienates anyone. If it does, these people should look back at their priorities in life.
  - sandworm101 8y ago
    A "clean look" means not having the inventory, not having a vast selection on the shelves. It means selling packages, clean boxes of parts, rather than individual bit. I wouldn't walk into a "clean look" to replace a broken connector or motor accessory. And it isn't just because I don't think they will have the part. I don't want to be upsold the newest model. I don't want to be told my device is out of date. I wouldn't walk into the apple store asking for a new headphone jack.
  - wolfgke 8y ago
    > I fail to see how having a clean looking store alienates anyone. I do not claim that. But it is a strong sign of the direction that the Raspberry Pi Foundation might want to target in the future. And this direction has a potential to alienate the core audience.
    - folkrav 8y ago
      That's basically being angry at what they might do, which is a very premature kneejerk reaction. If they end up alienating them, they'll stop following. I still fail to see how it's really a problem. Us "nerds" are just never happy.
tomatotomato37 8y ago
Isn't the primary users of RPi essentially nerds though? The average person isn't the type to hack one into a garage door to open via app or rig up a pi-hole to filter their smart TV, that's the domain of the stereotypical hacker nerd. I can see the appeal of widening the net to turn more potential nerds to the dark side, but if you just don't have any interest into this stuff to begin with than a shiny store isn't going to change that.
- cbhl 8y ago
  If I recall correctly, the folks who made RPi have serious nostalgia for the BBC Micro. So even if the target demo is nerdy kids, they need to interface with less-than-nerdy parents and teachers who make buying decisions for those kids. Element14 isn't exactly the most friendly website for a lay person...

whywhywhywhy 8y ago

> Looking approachable is a pretty key component of that. Agreed, the other key component though is actually making their machine and software/hardware approachable, smooth, performant and reliable. Which they haven't really put any effort in to since they started. I really wanted the dream of an affordable computer for kids to be a reality but at the end of the day when the $35 just isn't as performant as a budget tablet around the same price then kids are going to just end up with tablets and never have the opportunity to crack the machine open. If the product doesn't live up to the sales pitch of the store, then the product is just going to get returned.

wolfgke 8y ago
> I really wanted the dream of an affordable computer for kids to be a reality but at the end of the day when the $35 just isn't as performant as a budget tablet around the same price then kids are going to just end up with tablets and never have the opportunity to crack the machine open. For the children that love to tinker, $€35 will probably not be an obstacle. Tablets and RPis appeal to quite different audiences.
HeadsUpHigh 8y ago
Tinkering is not the same as consuming media/games. The kids who play with tablets and the kids who tinker with pis are completely different demographics( or the same person at different times). While I agree that the rpi leaves a lot to be desired( and other boards have left it in the dust hardware-wise) it is still the most accessible board out there and to say that they haven't improved on that is false( especially with software).
- whywhywhywhy 8y ago
  I totally get that I just think there is a lot of value to the tinkering being possible on the device they use for everything else. How many kids got a PC to play games on but while bored found QBasic and Gorillas.bas. How many kids on MySpace or NeoPets learnt HTML/CSS as a way to customize their profiles. This all used to be a reality when kids grew up using a general purpose computing platform, now the choices are a Tablet that works as a general purpose platform you can't tinker with or a board you can only tinker on but not use as a computer.
  - HeadsUpHigh 8y ago
    I agree. But a tablet is only possible because you can't tinker with it( hardware limitations, how would you fit connectors etc in it?). The software side of things could be better but you also have to keep in mind that an RPi makes both hardware and software tinkering on a very cheap package. Tinkering with software on an old PC was possible but tinkering with hardware would risk a fairly expensive machine.
fenwick67 8y ago
If they fixed power (stop using USB micro B, add a power switch header) and SD card stuff (let me boot from USB), I would be so much happier with my pis. But as it stands they are really messy to work with.
- cbhl 8y ago
  Using USB micro B lowers the BOM while making the device accessible in international markets (regardless of what your local power is, everyone has USB power adapters). Personally, I'd like to USB-C, but USB-C headers are still hella expensive. That being said, you can power a Pi by attaching the right cables to the GPIO headers: https://www.adafruit.com/product/954 https://www.adafruit.com/product/954 https://learn.adafruit.com/adafruits-raspberry-pi-lesson-5-using-a-console-cable/connect-the-lead https://learn.adafruit.com/adafruits-raspberry-pi-lesson-5-u... Booting from USB required a hardware change, and appears to be available in the latest versions of the Pi: https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/hardware/raspberrypi/bootmodes/msd.md https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/hardware/raspberry... (Admittedly, it looks like you need a microSD card to boot the Pi so you can reconfigure it this way.)
  - fenwick67 8y ago
    Wow I truly did not know you could simply boot from USB on the 3+, thanks for that.

eponeponepon 8y ago

unless wood and white is now reserved for Apple... I wouldn't put it past them to try...

bluescrn 8y ago

The RPi is for nerds, so long as we class engineers, scientists, makers and so on as nerds. The non-nerdy masses aren’t interested, they’re happily consuming content on iOS or Android, or doing work on Windows/MacOS

wolfgke 8y ago

> The "RPi is for nerds" shtick is specifically what they're probably trying to get rid of with that store. Companies should be very careful not to alienate their core audience that made them big. In the past, lots of companies in their plans to widen their audiences made this mistake.

folkrav 8y ago
I fail to see how having a clean looking store alienates anyone. If it does, these people should look back at their priorities in life.
- sandworm101 8y ago
  A "clean look" means not having the inventory, not having a vast selection on the shelves. It means selling packages, clean boxes of parts, rather than individual bit. I wouldn't walk into a "clean look" to replace a broken connector or motor accessory. And it isn't just because I don't think they will have the part. I don't want to be upsold the newest model. I don't want to be told my device is out of date. I wouldn't walk into the apple store asking for a new headphone jack.
- wolfgke 8y ago
  > I fail to see how having a clean looking store alienates anyone. I do not claim that. But it is a strong sign of the direction that the Raspberry Pi Foundation might want to target in the future. And this direction has a potential to alienate the core audience.
  - folkrav 8y ago
    That's basically being angry at what they might do, which is a very premature kneejerk reaction. If they end up alienating them, they'll stop following. I still fail to see how it's really a problem. Us "nerds" are just never happy.

tomatotomato37 8y ago

Isn't the primary users of RPi essentially nerds though? The average person isn't the type to hack one into a garage door to open via app or rig up a pi-hole to filter their smart TV, that's the domain of the stereotypical hacker nerd. I can see the appeal of widening the net to turn more potential nerds to the dark side, but if you just don't have any interest into this stuff to begin with than a shiny store isn't going to change that.

cbhl 8y ago
If I recall correctly, the folks who made RPi have serious nostalgia for the BBC Micro. So even if the target demo is nerdy kids, they need to interface with less-than-nerdy parents and teachers who make buying decisions for those kids. Element14 isn't exactly the most friendly website for a lay person...