3 ms·

Maybe it's because it's taboo to say so, but I haven't even seen it speculated that the rise of these diseases be partly, or even mainly attributed to illegal i

Maybe it's because it's taboo to say so, but I haven't even seen it speculated that the rise of these diseases be partly, or even mainly attributed to illegal immigration. How many anti-vaxxers are there compared to those illegally crossing the border? There's a battery of vaccine requirements for any immigrant[1], but if tens of millions of those living in America skipped that part, it seems like a huge potential source of the problem. 1. https://www.uscis.gov/news/questions-and-answers/vaccination-requirements https://www.uscis.gov/news/questions-and-answers/vaccination...

bleriot 8y ago
Looks like you got downvoted by the usual anti-science politically-correct contingent here on HN, but you’re right to investigate that possibility. Here’s an analysis of the last major outbreak in the early 90s that shows how huge a factor unvaccinated undocumented Hispanics were : https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00001675.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00001675.htm
- wrsh07 8y ago
  It's a bit ridiculous to call people who downvoted an incorrect and unjustified statement "anti science" If the original post had contained the link yours does, that would be one thing entirely. Instead, neither post invites discussion (tip: insulting people is a bad way to start a conversation)
  - bleriot 8y ago
    How was his statement incorrect or unjustified? (tip: calling something incorrect and unjustified just because you don’t like it is a bad way to start a conversation)
aaronharnly 8y ago
According to this World Bank data[1], the measles vaccination rates in the countries that are the top sources [2] of illegal immigration in the US: * United States: 92% vaccination * Washington State: 90.6% vaccination * Mexico (55% of illegal immigrants): 96% vaccination * El Salvador (6% of illegal immigrants): 85% * Guatemala (5% of illegal immigrants): 86% * India (4% of illegal immigrants): 88% * Honduras (3% of illegal immigrants): 97% * Philippines (3% of illegal immigrants): 89% So I’d say that theory is not strongly supported by the evidence. But it’s entirely appropriate to evaluate the possibility, and there could very well be a lower vaccination rate among illegal immigrant populations. Had you phrased your point differently — as a matter of inquiry into the epidemiology — it likely would’ve been received better. Also, your post made no real attempt to quantify the real and well documented phenomenon of philosophical/cultural objections to vaccination among the citizen population in Washington, which is surely relevant! [1] https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.IMM.MEAS?view=map https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.IMM.MEAS?view=map [2] https://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/publications/Unauthorized%20Immigrant%20Population%20Estimates%20in%20the%20US%20January%202014_1.pdf https://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/publications/Unautho...
Johnny555 8y ago
You'd think that if illegal immigrants crossing the southern border are bringing in these diseases, we'd see regular outbreaks in cities on both sides of the border instead of in a much more northern known anti-vax enclave? Even the affected parents are accepting responsibility and calling it an "inbreak" rather than an "outbreak".
PhantomGremlin 8y ago
From what has been reported on the news, it's only children that have come down with measles in Washington State. No reports of adults so far. US schools must accept any and all undocumented immigrant children into K-12 schools. This was a 1982 US Supreme Court ruling. So immigration status shouldn't be a barrier to vaccination for children. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plyler_v._Doe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plyler_v._Doe
eh78ssxv2f 8y ago
Seattle times published data of percentage of unvaccinated children in Seattle schools (https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/data/are-measles-a-risk-at-your-kids-school-explore-vaccination-exemption-data-with-our-new-tool/ https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/data/are-measles-a...). Each and every school in top 10 is a private school. In Seattle, private schools cost an average of $25k/year. I bet illegal immigrants are not sending their children to the private schools that cost $25k every year when public schools are free. The top schools is Waldorf which costs $20k/year for grade 1-8 and $25k for 9-12. This fee is only for 9 months of school. This school has 22% unvaccinated children. I bet there are exactly 0 children in this school from illegal immigrant families.
anigbrowl 8y ago
That's weird because there has been a whole disinformation campaign pushing exactly that idea, even though it's totally bogus and people in most other countries are grateful as hell for the opportunity to get their kids vaccinated.

bleriot 8y ago

Looks like you got downvoted by the usual anti-science politically-correct contingent here on HN, but you’re right to investigate that possibility. Here’s an analysis of the last major outbreak in the early 90s that shows how huge a factor unvaccinated undocumented Hispanics were : https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00001675.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00001675.htm

wrsh07 8y ago
It's a bit ridiculous to call people who downvoted an incorrect and unjustified statement "anti science" If the original post had contained the link yours does, that would be one thing entirely. Instead, neither post invites discussion (tip: insulting people is a bad way to start a conversation)
- bleriot 8y ago
  How was his statement incorrect or unjustified? (tip: calling something incorrect and unjustified just because you don’t like it is a bad way to start a conversation)

aaronharnly 8y ago

According to this World Bank data[1], the measles vaccination rates in the countries that are the top sources [2] of illegal immigration in the US: * United States: 92% vaccination * Washington State: 90.6% vaccination * Mexico (55% of illegal immigrants): 96% vaccination * El Salvador (6% of illegal immigrants): 85% * Guatemala (5% of illegal immigrants): 86% * India (4% of illegal immigrants): 88% * Honduras (3% of illegal immigrants): 97% * Philippines (3% of illegal immigrants): 89% So I’d say that theory is not strongly supported by the evidence. But it’s entirely appropriate to evaluate the possibility, and there could very well be a lower vaccination rate among illegal immigrant populations. Had you phrased your point differently — as a matter of inquiry into the epidemiology — it likely would’ve been received better. Also, your post made no real attempt to quantify the real and well documented phenomenon of philosophical/cultural objections to vaccination among the citizen population in Washington, which is surely relevant! [1] https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.IMM.MEAS?view=map https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.IMM.MEAS?view=map [2] https://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/publications/Unauthorized%20Immigrant%20Population%20Estimates%20in%20the%20US%20January%202014_1.pdf https://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/publications/Unautho...

Johnny555 8y ago

You'd think that if illegal immigrants crossing the southern border are bringing in these diseases, we'd see regular outbreaks in cities on both sides of the border instead of in a much more northern known anti-vax enclave? Even the affected parents are accepting responsibility and calling it an "inbreak" rather than an "outbreak".

PhantomGremlin 8y ago

From what has been reported on the news, it's only children that have come down with measles in Washington State. No reports of adults so far. US schools must accept any and all undocumented immigrant children into K-12 schools. This was a 1982 US Supreme Court ruling. So immigration status shouldn't be a barrier to vaccination for children. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plyler_v._Doe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plyler_v._Doe

eh78ssxv2f 8y ago

Seattle times published data of percentage of unvaccinated children in Seattle schools (https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/data/are-measles-a-risk-at-your-kids-school-explore-vaccination-exemption-data-with-our-new-tool/ https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/data/are-measles-a...). Each and every school in top 10 is a private school. In Seattle, private schools cost an average of $25k/year. I bet illegal immigrants are not sending their children to the private schools that cost $25k every year when public schools are free. The top schools is Waldorf which costs $20k/year for grade 1-8 and $25k for 9-12. This fee is only for 9 months of school. This school has 22% unvaccinated children. I bet there are exactly 0 children in this school from illegal immigrant families.

anigbrowl 8y ago

That's weird because there has been a whole disinformation campaign pushing exactly that idea, even though it's totally bogus and people in most other countries are grateful as hell for the opportunity to get their kids vaccinated.