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You'd be surprised how few people are willing to be bad actors. The other thing is that tests have proven people trust more if you offer a warranty or even a m

You'd be surprised how few people are willing to be bad actors. The other thing is that tests have proven people trust more if you offer a warranty or even a money-back warranty. Skullcandy headphones are a great example, they're budget headphones that are nothing out there, a little pricy but they have a lifetime warranty. What's a lifetime warranty? They'll replace them as long as you are alive.

gk1 8y ago
V-Moda had (still have?) a similar warranty on their headphones. They broke every year like clockwork, and every time I mailed it in for a brand new pair. This went on for at least four or five years.
- kamarg 8y ago
  At least with my recent V-Moda pair they changed it to send us your broken ones and we'll give you a certain amount off your next pair depending on what pair you're sending in and what pair you're buying next. Still a good experience but not as good as the old it broke so here's a shiny new one for free.
theNJR 8y ago
Agreed. I remember those bad actors because they were so extreme and rare. Certainly less than 1%.
- bonestamp2 8y ago
  Reminds me of this time when I bought a box of andes mints circa 2007. The glue that was used to hold the packaging closed was all over the chocolate. It wasn't a big deal, but I was disappointed and I wanted to let them know so they can fix the problem. They wrote back to me saying, "Don't worry, the glue is edible." Ok cool. I don't want to eat the "glue", but I think they missed my point. So I reply suggesting people probably don't want to eat the glue so they should fix the production issue to improve the quality of their product, even if it's just aesthetic. They wrote back asking how much free product would make me happy. None. I didn't want anything for free, I just wanted to make them aware of the problem. But they're operating on the assumption that everyone who complains is a bad actor who wants something for free. But sometimes a money back guarantee is just a good channel to get valuable feedback, if you're willing to accept it.
  - WrtCdEvrydy 8y ago
    > everyone who complains is a bad actor who wants something for free You'd be surprised how often that is true. Most companies are willing to send free stuff in order to improve your mental image of their product or service.
    - JohnFen 8y ago
      If a company's product or service is bad, there's no amount of free stuff that they could offer that would improve my image of them. What does improve my image of them is if they acknowledge the problem, treat it (and me) seriously, and make a credible-sounding promise that they'll fix the problem in the future. If all that's done, giving me a refund or replacement will further enhance the company in my eyes, but if it feels like they're just buying me off, it doesn't.
    - bonestamp2 8y ago
      I realize that. I'm saying they're not actually solving the problem, nor are they improving their image. In some cases, sure the customer has been wronged and a replacement should be sent. But that's only half the solution, and the less important half at that. More importantly, they have to find a way to prevent that problem from happening again so they don't alienate the much larger group of people who will never complain but will simply switch brands.
      - WrtCdEvrydy 8y ago
        It's mostly prevention for chargebacks. Companies hate the bad rep for chargebacks. Most companies would rather refund your money with no questions than deal with the wrath of credit card companies.
  - jonplackett 8y ago
    This reminds me of some great customer service I had at a fast food place in the Uk called Leon. I had a problem with a meal, something minor like an over cooked egg. When I returned it the manager said “Thanks so much for telling me. I will go make sure they do the next one right. And of course here’s a replacement.” It really stood out to me because of the thank you, not for the replacement meal. Attitude is everything!
sct202 8y ago
You just have to be careful if the bad actors start to recruit other bad actors. There are discords and Facebook groups that are dedicated to sharing where you can exploit a generous policy or error.
- WrtCdEvrydy 8y ago
  There's a difference, I've seen plenty of people pile into pricing errors on websites. Noone's buying 500 headphones just to return them a money back guarantee. The only issue you'll have is people abusing the crap out of stuff and expecting a money back guarantee.
- woolvalley 8y ago
  I think there is a difference in most people's minds between exploiting an upfront pricing/policy mistake and lying after you agreed to pay for something. One is legal, the other one is a crime for starters. Morally it feels fairly different too.
- muzani 8y ago
  This is true, but the counterweight is that there are good actors who recruit other good actors too.
JohnFen 8y ago
> The other thing is that tests have proven people trust more if you offer a warranty or even a money-back warranty. Personally, in my own purchasing decisions, warranties mean nothing to me (They're a huge hassle, and I've never had an experience with warranties that didn't make me feel like I've been ripped off) -- but money back guarantees mean a huge amount. Buying something without trying it first is a very risky thing to do. A money-back guarantee (particularly a no-questions-asked one) removes that risk from me and makes it much more likely that I'll take a chance on a product.

gk1 8y ago

V-Moda had (still have?) a similar warranty on their headphones. They broke every year like clockwork, and every time I mailed it in for a brand new pair. This went on for at least four or five years.

kamarg 8y ago
At least with my recent V-Moda pair they changed it to send us your broken ones and we'll give you a certain amount off your next pair depending on what pair you're sending in and what pair you're buying next. Still a good experience but not as good as the old it broke so here's a shiny new one for free.

theNJR 8y ago

Agreed. I remember those bad actors because they were so extreme and rare. Certainly less than 1%.

bonestamp2 8y ago
Reminds me of this time when I bought a box of andes mints circa 2007. The glue that was used to hold the packaging closed was all over the chocolate. It wasn't a big deal, but I was disappointed and I wanted to let them know so they can fix the problem. They wrote back to me saying, "Don't worry, the glue is edible." Ok cool. I don't want to eat the "glue", but I think they missed my point. So I reply suggesting people probably don't want to eat the glue so they should fix the production issue to improve the quality of their product, even if it's just aesthetic. They wrote back asking how much free product would make me happy. None. I didn't want anything for free, I just wanted to make them aware of the problem. But they're operating on the assumption that everyone who complains is a bad actor who wants something for free. But sometimes a money back guarantee is just a good channel to get valuable feedback, if you're willing to accept it.
- WrtCdEvrydy 8y ago
  > everyone who complains is a bad actor who wants something for free You'd be surprised how often that is true. Most companies are willing to send free stuff in order to improve your mental image of their product or service.
  - JohnFen 8y ago
    If a company's product or service is bad, there's no amount of free stuff that they could offer that would improve my image of them. What does improve my image of them is if they acknowledge the problem, treat it (and me) seriously, and make a credible-sounding promise that they'll fix the problem in the future. If all that's done, giving me a refund or replacement will further enhance the company in my eyes, but if it feels like they're just buying me off, it doesn't.
  - bonestamp2 8y ago
    I realize that. I'm saying they're not actually solving the problem, nor are they improving their image. In some cases, sure the customer has been wronged and a replacement should be sent. But that's only half the solution, and the less important half at that. More importantly, they have to find a way to prevent that problem from happening again so they don't alienate the much larger group of people who will never complain but will simply switch brands.
    - WrtCdEvrydy 8y ago
      It's mostly prevention for chargebacks. Companies hate the bad rep for chargebacks. Most companies would rather refund your money with no questions than deal with the wrath of credit card companies.
- jonplackett 8y ago
  This reminds me of some great customer service I had at a fast food place in the Uk called Leon. I had a problem with a meal, something minor like an over cooked egg. When I returned it the manager said “Thanks so much for telling me. I will go make sure they do the next one right. And of course here’s a replacement.” It really stood out to me because of the thank you, not for the replacement meal. Attitude is everything!

sct202 8y ago

You just have to be careful if the bad actors start to recruit other bad actors. There are discords and Facebook groups that are dedicated to sharing where you can exploit a generous policy or error.

WrtCdEvrydy 8y ago
There's a difference, I've seen plenty of people pile into pricing errors on websites. Noone's buying 500 headphones just to return them a money back guarantee. The only issue you'll have is people abusing the crap out of stuff and expecting a money back guarantee.
woolvalley 8y ago
I think there is a difference in most people's minds between exploiting an upfront pricing/policy mistake and lying after you agreed to pay for something. One is legal, the other one is a crime for starters. Morally it feels fairly different too.
muzani 8y ago
This is true, but the counterweight is that there are good actors who recruit other good actors too.

JohnFen 8y ago

> The other thing is that tests have proven people trust more if you offer a warranty or even a money-back warranty. Personally, in my own purchasing decisions, warranties mean nothing to me (They're a huge hassle, and I've never had an experience with warranties that didn't make me feel like I've been ripped off) -- but money back guarantees mean a huge amount. Buying something without trying it first is a very risky thing to do. A money-back guarantee (particularly a no-questions-asked one) removes that risk from me and makes it much more likely that I'll take a chance on a product.