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"Paris’s metro was inaugurated in 1900, but its well-maintained system continues to run excellently and expand continuously." Any daily commuter in Paris will

"Paris’s metro was inaugurated in 1900, but its well-maintained system continues to run excellently and expand continuously." Any daily commuter in Paris will tell you that this is untrue. Trains are often extremely full, delays happen frequently and many stations are deeply run down.

JackFr 8y ago
As a New Yorker taking the Metro in Paris was decidedly underwhelming. It didn't seem appreciably cleaner or dirtier or more os less safe & reliable than the NYC subway.
- agumonkey 8y ago
  It's a shame, to the point that I have dreams of starting a lavander club to spread flowers onto the decks
simias 8y ago
I also felt that the article made European transport systems appear better than they really are in order to make a point. That being said it is true that the metro keeps expanding (they're currently expanding the line 14 towards the north, hopefully in order to take some of the load of the extremely overcrowded line 13) and they've also extended one tramway line recently. On top of that public transportation in Paris is heavily subsidized and pretty cheap, a lot cheaper than London for instance. On the other hand it's true that many Parisian stations are simply disgusting and could urgently use a renovation. Given how hugely touristic Paris is it's quite shameful really.
- lucb1e 8y ago
  Yeah I'm also not a big fan of the French metro, and as a Dutchman living in Germany I can say that the German also leaves quite something to be desired. I can't imagine what the American system must look like if it's made out like that. Anyone here who lived in the Netherlands as well as the USA to compare?
  - magduf 8y ago
    >and as a Dutchman living in Germany I can say that the German also leaves quite something to be desired. Where in Germany do you live? I was just in Munich and the U-bahn there is fantastic compared to anything I've ever seen in America. It was crowded during rush hour, but aside from that, everything was clean and organized, and the trains were really quite smooth to ride on unlike the ones in DC and NYC.
    - lucb1e 8y ago
      I guess in big cities like Cologne, Berlin and Munich, it's probably equivalent. In and around Aachen, the bus schedule is more of a "definitely not before" schedule (e.g. "09:30 Bushof" does not mean "bus will be around 09:30 at the bushof", it means "bus will definitely not be at the bushof before 09:30, but some time after that, and before the next one is scheduled to go"). It's not reliably late, either: some days it's 1 minute late, some days 10. You also can't see when it will be late: there does not seem to be live tracking that tells you within a minute when the bus will actually be there. I only recently found the website from the local company that can tell the difference between "within 5 minutes on time" and "more than 5 minutes late". It tells you "+3" (rounded to the minute it seems) but that could mean anything between +3 and, say, +8, and after the departure time +3 minutes, it just removes it from the departures list, even if you're standing at the stop and you're sure quite sure it hasn't left yet... Deutsche Bahn and Öffi claim to have realtime data but they don't. Having to get info from disparate companies is another thing: in the Netherlands there is a collective of public transport companies (iirc it's NDOV) that creates a common standard that apps and websites can use for information (things like the coordinates of all stations and stops, schedules, and delays precise to a few seconds). It just seems like a big mess, probably due to the lower population density. On the upside, that lower density means you actually have nature: I can drive an hour and be in the middle of nowhere. Having that space is kind of nice. That just doesn't exist in the Netherlands (there doesn't seem to be any place more than 500 metres removed from any road, path or building). That said, > compared to anything I've ever seen in America I haven't been to the USA so I can't make that comparison. Like I said, I can't imagine what the American system must look like if it's made out to be so much worse than Germany.
andrew_ 8y ago
I have to agree here. Was in Paris last February and "underwhelming" was exactly the word that came to mind. I've been on the mass transit systems in most of the major metro areas in the US, and have been fortunate enough to ride on a handful in Europe. If one system stands out to me, I'd have to say the underground in London.
jgtrosh 8y ago
Everything is relative. I complain often since I've been taking line 13 regularly, but in general it holds up very well in comparison with other systems.
ip26 8y ago
For my own reference, can you compare Paris's metro to Marseilles?
HelloNurse 8y ago
Many subway stations in Paris are very old; comparing RER stations to stations of newer subways (e.g. Amsterdam) would be more fair.
agumonkey 8y ago
intra-paris subway as few delays, it's choke full quite often that's true, it stinks, finding it's way out is NP-complete outer rim paris on the other hand will show you what a delay is mainstream theory is that national company was more interested by luxury high speed rail than true public transportation. Which is also cited as one cause for the yellow vest thing because bad public transportation => more car rides => people super angry if oil taxes increase.

JackFr 8y ago

As a New Yorker taking the Metro in Paris was decidedly underwhelming. It didn't seem appreciably cleaner or dirtier or more os less safe & reliable than the NYC subway.

agumonkey 8y ago
It's a shame, to the point that I have dreams of starting a lavander club to spread flowers onto the decks

simias 8y ago

I also felt that the article made European transport systems appear better than they really are in order to make a point. That being said it is true that the metro keeps expanding (they're currently expanding the line 14 towards the north, hopefully in order to take some of the load of the extremely overcrowded line 13) and they've also extended one tramway line recently. On top of that public transportation in Paris is heavily subsidized and pretty cheap, a lot cheaper than London for instance. On the other hand it's true that many Parisian stations are simply disgusting and could urgently use a renovation. Given how hugely touristic Paris is it's quite shameful really.

lucb1e 8y ago
Yeah I'm also not a big fan of the French metro, and as a Dutchman living in Germany I can say that the German also leaves quite something to be desired. I can't imagine what the American system must look like if it's made out like that. Anyone here who lived in the Netherlands as well as the USA to compare?
- magduf 8y ago
  >and as a Dutchman living in Germany I can say that the German also leaves quite something to be desired. Where in Germany do you live? I was just in Munich and the U-bahn there is fantastic compared to anything I've ever seen in America. It was crowded during rush hour, but aside from that, everything was clean and organized, and the trains were really quite smooth to ride on unlike the ones in DC and NYC.
  - lucb1e 8y ago
    I guess in big cities like Cologne, Berlin and Munich, it's probably equivalent. In and around Aachen, the bus schedule is more of a "definitely not before" schedule (e.g. "09:30 Bushof" does not mean "bus will be around 09:30 at the bushof", it means "bus will definitely not be at the bushof before 09:30, but some time after that, and before the next one is scheduled to go"). It's not reliably late, either: some days it's 1 minute late, some days 10. You also can't see when it will be late: there does not seem to be live tracking that tells you within a minute when the bus will actually be there. I only recently found the website from the local company that can tell the difference between "within 5 minutes on time" and "more than 5 minutes late". It tells you "+3" (rounded to the minute it seems) but that could mean anything between +3 and, say, +8, and after the departure time +3 minutes, it just removes it from the departures list, even if you're standing at the stop and you're sure quite sure it hasn't left yet... Deutsche Bahn and Öffi claim to have realtime data but they don't. Having to get info from disparate companies is another thing: in the Netherlands there is a collective of public transport companies (iirc it's NDOV) that creates a common standard that apps and websites can use for information (things like the coordinates of all stations and stops, schedules, and delays precise to a few seconds). It just seems like a big mess, probably due to the lower population density. On the upside, that lower density means you actually have nature: I can drive an hour and be in the middle of nowhere. Having that space is kind of nice. That just doesn't exist in the Netherlands (there doesn't seem to be any place more than 500 metres removed from any road, path or building). That said, > compared to anything I've ever seen in America I haven't been to the USA so I can't make that comparison. Like I said, I can't imagine what the American system must look like if it's made out to be so much worse than Germany.

andrew_ 8y ago

I have to agree here. Was in Paris last February and "underwhelming" was exactly the word that came to mind. I've been on the mass transit systems in most of the major metro areas in the US, and have been fortunate enough to ride on a handful in Europe. If one system stands out to me, I'd have to say the underground in London.

jgtrosh 8y ago

Everything is relative. I complain often since I've been taking line 13 regularly, but in general it holds up very well in comparison with other systems.

ip26 8y ago

For my own reference, can you compare Paris's metro to Marseilles?

HelloNurse 8y ago

Many subway stations in Paris are very old; comparing RER stations to stations of newer subways (e.g. Amsterdam) would be more fair.

agumonkey 8y ago

intra-paris subway as few delays, it's choke full quite often that's true, it stinks, finding it's way out is NP-complete outer rim paris on the other hand will show you what a delay is mainstream theory is that national company was more interested by luxury high speed rail than true public transportation. Which is also cited as one cause for the yellow vest thing because bad public transportation => more car rides => people super angry if oil taxes increase.