6 ms·

> fined for swearing at the police Punished for speech?

by Simon_says 8y ago

robjan 8y ago
All speech isn't equal. Nobody has the right to use threatening or intimidating language
- yardie 8y ago
  Telling someone to “piss off” is neither threatening nor intimidating.
- robjan 8y ago
  @yardie it entirely depends on the intonation and any body language. If you shout "piss off" at someone whilst acting aggressively then I would argue that it's intimidating
  - abnry 8y ago
    I'd never advocate showing anything but the upmost respect to the police. But as a matter of policy, who is really the one being threatening here? The man bristling at the government collecting personal data or the police officer with backup and (presumably) violent means of arresting the man?
    - DanBC 8y ago
      The people being threatened are not the police, but the other members of the public. (I'm not saying that I agree with this, but it is the argument being used).
      - salawat 8y ago
        Where is this 'public'? Is this the same group of people who keep expressing opinions that my rights should be curtailed? Officer, arrest them! They are intimidating me by their refusal to respect my human rights! It's kind of a slippery slope once you start trying to carve the troublemakers out from the public. That action can even be said to be incitory by it's nature. Perhaps the police should arrest themselves for being a walking intimidation tool for the majority? Dirty business that. If you're not interfering in a clearly criminal act, you are just acting as an intimidation force. Unjustified weaponization of suspicion can be just as harmful to a Law Enforcement Organiztion's legitimacy as unjustified use of lethal force. The criminals you avoid creating through mounting I'll will and despair from the inevitable taint of interacting with the legal system will be a net gain for society. I'm not saying without Leo's there would be no criminals; rather that continual nuisance and intrusion of the Systems in law abiding citizen's lives only serves to push more of the population toward unrest.
    - clubm8 8y ago
      > I'd never advocate showing anything but the upmost respect to the police. I'd advocate showing nothing but contempt to a police officer who refuses to let me go about my business when I have committed no crimes.
  - gaius 8y ago
    "piss off" is accurately interpreted as "go away and leave me alone". Whereas "fucking come on then" is often a precursor to violence. But sure, intonation is a thing. "I beg your pardon" can be said in a threatening way.
  - deogeo 8y ago
    So why is the punishment for 'swearing' instead of 'intimidating a police officer'?
  - clubm8 8y ago
    > @yardie it entirely depends on the intonation and any body language. If you shout "piss off" at someone whilst acting aggressively then I would argue that it's intimidating Well I'm sure the UK has professionals who can help you with these feelings of anxiety and dread
- johnisgood 8y ago
  Why not though? It's just language, which you can decide to ignore. Being annoying by repetitively saying something, or shouting in someone's face or ears, is of course different, but not because of the content of what has been said.
- clubm8 8y ago
  > All speech isn't equal. Nobody has the right to use threatening or intimidating language Is being told to "piss off" intimidating or threatening?
SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
That is correct. UK has no enumerated right of “free speech” as it exists in the USZ This is common in most European counties.

> fined for swearing at the police Punished for speech?

robjan 8y ago

All speech isn't equal. Nobody has the right to use threatening or intimidating language

yardie 8y ago
Telling someone to “piss off” is neither threatening nor intimidating.
robjan 8y ago
@yardie it entirely depends on the intonation and any body language. If you shout "piss off" at someone whilst acting aggressively then I would argue that it's intimidating
- abnry 8y ago
  I'd never advocate showing anything but the upmost respect to the police. But as a matter of policy, who is really the one being threatening here? The man bristling at the government collecting personal data or the police officer with backup and (presumably) violent means of arresting the man?
  - DanBC 8y ago
    The people being threatened are not the police, but the other members of the public. (I'm not saying that I agree with this, but it is the argument being used).
    - salawat 8y ago
      Where is this 'public'? Is this the same group of people who keep expressing opinions that my rights should be curtailed? Officer, arrest them! They are intimidating me by their refusal to respect my human rights! It's kind of a slippery slope once you start trying to carve the troublemakers out from the public. That action can even be said to be incitory by it's nature. Perhaps the police should arrest themselves for being a walking intimidation tool for the majority? Dirty business that. If you're not interfering in a clearly criminal act, you are just acting as an intimidation force. Unjustified weaponization of suspicion can be just as harmful to a Law Enforcement Organiztion's legitimacy as unjustified use of lethal force. The criminals you avoid creating through mounting I'll will and despair from the inevitable taint of interacting with the legal system will be a net gain for society. I'm not saying without Leo's there would be no criminals; rather that continual nuisance and intrusion of the Systems in law abiding citizen's lives only serves to push more of the population toward unrest.
  - clubm8 8y ago
    > I'd never advocate showing anything but the upmost respect to the police. I'd advocate showing nothing but contempt to a police officer who refuses to let me go about my business when I have committed no crimes.
- gaius 8y ago
  "piss off" is accurately interpreted as "go away and leave me alone". Whereas "fucking come on then" is often a precursor to violence. But sure, intonation is a thing. "I beg your pardon" can be said in a threatening way.
- deogeo 8y ago
  So why is the punishment for 'swearing' instead of 'intimidating a police officer'?
- clubm8 8y ago
  > @yardie it entirely depends on the intonation and any body language. If you shout "piss off" at someone whilst acting aggressively then I would argue that it's intimidating Well I'm sure the UK has professionals who can help you with these feelings of anxiety and dread
johnisgood 8y ago
Why not though? It's just language, which you can decide to ignore. Being annoying by repetitively saying something, or shouting in someone's face or ears, is of course different, but not because of the content of what has been said.
clubm8 8y ago
> All speech isn't equal. Nobody has the right to use threatening or intimidating language Is being told to "piss off" intimidating or threatening?

SlowRobotAhead 8y ago

That is correct. UK has no enumerated right of “free speech” as it exists in the USZ This is common in most European counties.