5 ms·

A Post Mortem on Growth Hacking

57 points by andygcook 8y ago

klosure 8y ago
Growth hacking is hard. We had to learn a few tricks to grow our Hacker News alternative (https://laarc.io https://laarc.io) Suppose you were to start a site similar to HN. How would you get the word out? The most reliable way to grow is to have an audience (or access to one). But they have to be interested in what you're showing, else you're little better than a spammer. Looking over the traffic for the last month (https://imgur.com/a/O1wtzav https://imgur.com/a/O1wtzav) the spikes were from comments posted to lobse.rs: https://lobste.rs/s/jqkqwb/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c_v1rpuv https://lobste.rs/s/jqkqwb/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c... https://lobste.rs/s/kx4ojt/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c_wivai7 https://lobste.rs/s/kx4ojt/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c... This won't keep working, but it might have been enough. The site seems to be spreading through word of mouth now, and about 400 people show up each day. Communities are also a strange thing to grow. Grow too fast, and you'll spoil it. Ditto if you grow from the wrong source of people. Fundamentally, you have to have a product that users love so much that they spontaneously tell their friends about it. But press coverage – or at least social media coverage – seems to matter a lot. You probably need both. We've been using https://playbook.samaltman.com/ https://playbook.samaltman.com/ as a mantra, and it's been effective so far. But it's only been a month. We'd like to try Michael's advice next: http://www.michaelseibel.com/blog/getting-press-for-your-startup http://www.michaelseibel.com/blog/getting-press-for-your-sta...
avip 8y ago
This post sidesteps the main issue: growth hacking becomes irrelevant because most involved parties are now aware of the breadth and depth of fraud involved. Fake users, paid download farms, automated registrations. VCs learned the lesson.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
AznHisoka 8y ago
I would caution against making conclusions solely on Google Trends. Less people may be googling growth hacking because more and more people are becoming familar with it. However that doesnt mean the demand for growth hackers is declining. People may already know what it is but the need for growth hacking may still be increasing. Or it might have different names that people call it by now.
- louisswiss 8y ago
  I think that's partly it. As 'technical' marketing becomes a more developed industry, it's splitting into more distinct job roles. The days of hiring a growth hacker to plaster over your CMO's shortcomings are disappearing rapidly.
- nickm12 8y ago
  I think this topic is an interesting one and I'd love to read about from someone who could speak authoritatively about industry trends. But trying to do the same by reading Google Trends tea leaves is just awful.
  - uclacademix 8y ago
    Hi there. I wrote the article. You bring up a fair point but unfortunately there isn't any other public data of high quality that can be referenced. I hit LinkedIn's APIs to try and get data on historical job postings for new roles containing "growth hacker" in it but the data is really poor and not useable. I'm also writing from experience + anecdotes having worked on growth for 10+ years and advised a variety of consumer companies on growth. The anecdotes suggest to me it is falling out of favor. I wish there was more data to reference otherwise I would have.
    - AznHisoka 8y ago
      Hmm... why was the Linkedin data poor?
      - 8y ago
devconsole 8y ago
Growth hacking is hard. We had to learn a few tricks to grow our Hacker News alternative (https://laarc.io https://laarc.io) Suppose you were to start a site similar to HN. How would you get the word out? The most reliable way to grow is to have an audience (or access to one). But they have to be interested in what you're showing, else you're little better than a spammer. Looking over the traffic for the last month (https://imgur.com/a/O1wtzav https://imgur.com/a/O1wtzav) the spikes were from comments posted to lobse.rs: https://lobste.rs/s/jqkqwb/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c_v1rpuv https://lobste.rs/s/jqkqwb/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c... https://lobste.rs/s/kx4ojt/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c_wivai7 https://lobste.rs/s/kx4ojt/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c... This won't keep working, but it might have been enough. The site seems to be spreading through word of mouth now, and about 400 people show up each day. Communities are also a strange thing to grow. Grow too fast, and you'll spoil it. Ditto if you grow from the wrong source of people. Fundamentally, you have to have a product that users love so much that they spontaneously tell their friends about it. But press coverage – or at least social media coverage – seems to matter a lot. You probably need both. We've been using https://playbook.samaltman.com/ https://playbook.samaltman.com/ as a mantra, and it's been effective so far. But it's only been a month. We'd like to try Michael's advice next: http://www.michaelseibel.com/blog/getting-press-for-your-startup http://www.michaelseibel.com/blog/getting-press-for-your-sta...
- saberience 8y ago
  Nice try here! But still not visiting the site ;)
- factsaresacred 8y ago
  Why use the alternative when here we are on the perfectly fine original? Maybe it can't grow because it's an unnecessary and inferior substitute. I don't mean to sound harsh but if it's difficult to gain traction there's likely a reason. Which gets to the main point of the original article: you can't 'growth hack' a product that has no market from which to grow from. Build something people find valuable and it will grow is the only "hack" that truly works.
  - 8y ago
fizx 8y ago
For those who don't know, Andy was one of the early growth hacker leads at FB & Twitter.
contingencies 8y ago
Marketing is what you do when your product is no good. - Edwin Land, founder of Polaroid ... via http://github.com/globalcitizen/taoup http://github.com/globalcitizen/taoup
- davidivadavid 8y ago
  And yet Polaroid has spent considerable amounts of money on marketing. That statement is often quoted, but it's exactly backwards, and I'll raise you one more sensible quote: "Great marketing only makes a bad product fail faster." — David Ogilvy
  - contingencies 8y ago
    Ogilvy found public, untargeted advertising essentially immoral. Man is at his vilest when he erects a billboard. When I retire from Madison Avenue, I am going to start a secret society of masked vigilantes who will travel around the world on silent motor bicycles, chopping down posters at the dark of the moon. - David Ogilvy ... via http://github.com/globalcitizen/taoup http://github.com/globalcitizen/taoup
lqet 8y ago
I was not familiar with this term until now. You can read very far into this article without realizing that the topic is not some technique to gain a few inches in height. > There are now several growth hacking bootcamps and large conferences.
skilled 8y ago
OK... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19062698 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19062698

57 points by andygcook 8y ago

Growth hacking is hard. We had to learn a few tricks to grow our Hacker News alternative (https://laarc.io https://laarc.io) Suppose you were to start a site similar to HN. How would you get the word out? The most reliable way to grow is to have an audience (or access to one). But they have to be interested in what you're showing, else you're little better than a spammer. Looking over the traffic for the last month (https://imgur.com/a/O1wtzav https://imgur.com/a/O1wtzav) the spikes were from comments posted to lobse.rs: https://lobste.rs/s/jqkqwb/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c_v1rpuv https://lobste.rs/s/jqkqwb/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c... https://lobste.rs/s/kx4ojt/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c_wivai7 https://lobste.rs/s/kx4ojt/what_are_you_doing_this_weekend#c... This won't keep working, but it might have been enough. The site seems to be spreading through word of mouth now, and about 400 people show up each day. Communities are also a strange thing to grow. Grow too fast, and you'll spoil it. Ditto if you grow from the wrong source of people. Fundamentally, you have to have a product that users love so much that they spontaneously tell their friends about it. But press coverage – or at least social media coverage – seems to matter a lot. You probably need both. We've been using https://playbook.samaltman.com/ https://playbook.samaltman.com/ as a mantra, and it's been effective so far. But it's only been a month. We'd like to try Michael's advice next: http://www.michaelseibel.com/blog/getting-press-for-your-startup http://www.michaelseibel.com/blog/getting-press-for-your-sta...

avip 8y ago

This post sidesteps the main issue: growth hacking becomes irrelevant because most involved parties are now aware of the breadth and depth of fraud involved. Fake users, paid download farms, automated registrations. VCs learned the lesson.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

AznHisoka 8y ago

I would caution against making conclusions solely on Google Trends. Less people may be googling growth hacking because more and more people are becoming familar with it. However that doesnt mean the demand for growth hackers is declining. People may already know what it is but the need for growth hacking may still be increasing. Or it might have different names that people call it by now.

louisswiss 8y ago
I think that's partly it. As 'technical' marketing becomes a more developed industry, it's splitting into more distinct job roles. The days of hiring a growth hacker to plaster over your CMO's shortcomings are disappearing rapidly.
nickm12 8y ago
I think this topic is an interesting one and I'd love to read about from someone who could speak authoritatively about industry trends. But trying to do the same by reading Google Trends tea leaves is just awful.
- uclacademix 8y ago
  Hi there. I wrote the article. You bring up a fair point but unfortunately there isn't any other public data of high quality that can be referenced. I hit LinkedIn's APIs to try and get data on historical job postings for new roles containing "growth hacker" in it but the data is really poor and not useable. I'm also writing from experience + anecdotes having worked on growth for 10+ years and advised a variety of consumer companies on growth. The anecdotes suggest to me it is falling out of favor. I wish there was more data to reference otherwise I would have.
  - AznHisoka 8y ago
    Hmm... why was the Linkedin data poor?
    - 8y ago

devconsole 8y ago

saberience 8y ago
Nice try here! But still not visiting the site ;)
factsaresacred 8y ago
Why use the alternative when here we are on the perfectly fine original? Maybe it can't grow because it's an unnecessary and inferior substitute. I don't mean to sound harsh but if it's difficult to gain traction there's likely a reason. Which gets to the main point of the original article: you can't 'growth hack' a product that has no market from which to grow from. Build something people find valuable and it will grow is the only "hack" that truly works.
- 8y ago

fizx 8y ago

For those who don't know, Andy was one of the early growth hacker leads at FB & Twitter.

contingencies 8y ago

Marketing is what you do when your product is no good. - Edwin Land, founder of Polaroid ... via http://github.com/globalcitizen/taoup http://github.com/globalcitizen/taoup

davidivadavid 8y ago
And yet Polaroid has spent considerable amounts of money on marketing. That statement is often quoted, but it's exactly backwards, and I'll raise you one more sensible quote: "Great marketing only makes a bad product fail faster." — David Ogilvy
- contingencies 8y ago
  Ogilvy found public, untargeted advertising essentially immoral. Man is at his vilest when he erects a billboard. When I retire from Madison Avenue, I am going to start a secret society of masked vigilantes who will travel around the world on silent motor bicycles, chopping down posters at the dark of the moon. - David Ogilvy ... via http://github.com/globalcitizen/taoup http://github.com/globalcitizen/taoup

lqet 8y ago

I was not familiar with this term until now. You can read very far into this article without realizing that the topic is not some technique to gain a few inches in height. > There are now several growth hacking bootcamps and large conferences.

skilled 8y ago

OK... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19062698 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19062698