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Yet another aspect of crypto's long term ignored consequences come to light. i haven't seen ANY possible solution for transfer of crypto after original owner's

Yet another aspect of crypto's long term ignored consequences come to light. i haven't seen ANY possible solution for transfer of crypto after original owner's death. even ethereum doesn't have this simple ability inbuilt(which you'd think would be obvious). this basic question gets downvoted on any forum you'd think of - husband/wife has large amount of money in crypto, they die due to unforeseen circumstances(or even foreseen circumstances but it's a quick degradation of mental facilities). who does the spouse approach for the crypto? they have proof of death so why don't they get the money? poof, value gone - have fun now you're a destitute relative coz you can't figure out passwords(most grieving relatives can't)! this is why no one trusts crypto,these simple things aren't a fundamental part of the platform. you get people telling you these convoluted solutions(that may or may not work). the fraud potential is sky high. is crypto only meant as a transient toy?

dannyw 8y ago
This capacity exists, it’s called a dead mans switch. There are many ETH smart contracts which do this.
- cma 8y ago
  A small typo can throw all the money in the trash, while a typo in a real contract can be fixed by a court based on other evidence.
  - erikpukinskis 8y ago
    No, there is no legal difference. A small typo in a crypto contract does not entitle the beneficiary to the funds. Your access to restitution through the courts is exactly the same.
    - gizmo686 8y ago
      What beneficiary?
      - erikpukinskis 8y ago
        The thief.
    - gamblor956 8y ago
      A small typo in a crypto contract would not entitle the beneficiary to the funds...but a typo in a legal contract would, if sufficient other evidence of the true intent of the contract is available. That was the whole point of the comment you were replying to. Legal real-world contracts are simply better for the scenario described.
      - erikpukinskis 8y ago
        A typo implies there is no intent.
djohnston 8y ago
there is a way, you give a lawyer a key, or put it in a bank vault and incorporate it into your will. the only reason it's not transferable by default is because people can't touch it without your permission, which is a feature, not a bug.
jespern 8y ago
That's like saying cryptography is faulty since if someone encrypted an important document and threw away the key, it would be irrecoverable. That's the point. As for solutions, there are many: use a multi-sig contract with several owners (like a spouse and/or lawyer), or simply leave the seed phrase to be released in your will. The proposed solutions that "may or may not work" are easy to test, I'm not really sure where you get your information.
- roenxi 8y ago
  > That's like saying cryptography is faulty since if someone encrypted an important document and threw away the key, it would be irrecoverable. No, it is like saying cryptography has important long term consequences. I don't even see any synonyms for "fault" in the post. There are mechanisms if someone is careful about their estate planning, the issue is we have a great deal of evidence that most people don't do estate planning [0] and the courts have to clean up the mess. Kkarakk is completely correct in saying that a (potentially non-technical) spouse or heir is being exposed to an exciting new way of losing large sums of money that they are entitled to. This is clearly a disadvantage of cryptocurrency, even if it is an intentional part of the design. [0] https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-36325871 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-36325871
- kkarakk 8y ago
  what happens when your fancy multi-sig contract is disputed by non-technical folk and the matter goes to court? court could easily throw all that shit out and say the crypto goes to your first wife instead. no guarantee that it will work at all.
roywiggins 8y ago
Just stick a copy of your private key in a bank safe deposit box? That box will be inherited by your next of kin. Of course at this point you are (sort of) trusting a bank with your money (so why are you using crypto, again?) but it's probably safe and the safe deposit box + its contents would pass through all the usual legal procedures around an estate and more than likely pass safely to the intended beneficiary.
closeparen 8y ago
There is already a well oiled machine for reading your secret-until-death instructions and distributing your possessions. Telling it about your private key storage media and passphrase is not exactly convoluted. You could even leave parts of the key material with different lawyers/institutions, so that they would have to collude AND steal your hard drive/hardware wallet to access anything prematurely.
abecedarius 8y ago
https://www.amazon.com/Cryptoasset-Inheritance-Planning-Simple-Owners/dp/1947910116 https://www.amazon.com/Cryptoasset-Inheritance-Planning-Simp... Haven’t read it; I just googled “crypto estate planning” (which google had an autocomplete for).
- kkarakk 8y ago
  8 customer reviews, not even the top 200 when you search within the estate planning section...nice, i'm sure lots of people have read this

dannyw 8y ago

This capacity exists, it’s called a dead mans switch. There are many ETH smart contracts which do this.

cma 8y ago
A small typo can throw all the money in the trash, while a typo in a real contract can be fixed by a court based on other evidence.
- erikpukinskis 8y ago
  No, there is no legal difference. A small typo in a crypto contract does not entitle the beneficiary to the funds. Your access to restitution through the courts is exactly the same.
  - gizmo686 8y ago
    What beneficiary?
    - erikpukinskis 8y ago
      The thief.
  - gamblor956 8y ago
    A small typo in a crypto contract would not entitle the beneficiary to the funds...but a typo in a legal contract would, if sufficient other evidence of the true intent of the contract is available. That was the whole point of the comment you were replying to. Legal real-world contracts are simply better for the scenario described.
    - erikpukinskis 8y ago
      A typo implies there is no intent.

djohnston 8y ago

there is a way, you give a lawyer a key, or put it in a bank vault and incorporate it into your will. the only reason it's not transferable by default is because people can't touch it without your permission, which is a feature, not a bug.

jespern 8y ago

That's like saying cryptography is faulty since if someone encrypted an important document and threw away the key, it would be irrecoverable. That's the point. As for solutions, there are many: use a multi-sig contract with several owners (like a spouse and/or lawyer), or simply leave the seed phrase to be released in your will. The proposed solutions that "may or may not work" are easy to test, I'm not really sure where you get your information.

roenxi 8y ago
> That's like saying cryptography is faulty since if someone encrypted an important document and threw away the key, it would be irrecoverable. No, it is like saying cryptography has important long term consequences. I don't even see any synonyms for "fault" in the post. There are mechanisms if someone is careful about their estate planning, the issue is we have a great deal of evidence that most people don't do estate planning [0] and the courts have to clean up the mess. Kkarakk is completely correct in saying that a (potentially non-technical) spouse or heir is being exposed to an exciting new way of losing large sums of money that they are entitled to. This is clearly a disadvantage of cryptocurrency, even if it is an intentional part of the design. [0] https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-36325871 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-36325871
kkarakk 8y ago
what happens when your fancy multi-sig contract is disputed by non-technical folk and the matter goes to court? court could easily throw all that shit out and say the crypto goes to your first wife instead. no guarantee that it will work at all.

roywiggins 8y ago

Just stick a copy of your private key in a bank safe deposit box? That box will be inherited by your next of kin. Of course at this point you are (sort of) trusting a bank with your money (so why are you using crypto, again?) but it's probably safe and the safe deposit box + its contents would pass through all the usual legal procedures around an estate and more than likely pass safely to the intended beneficiary.

closeparen 8y ago

There is already a well oiled machine for reading your secret-until-death instructions and distributing your possessions. Telling it about your private key storage media and passphrase is not exactly convoluted. You could even leave parts of the key material with different lawyers/institutions, so that they would have to collude AND steal your hard drive/hardware wallet to access anything prematurely.

abecedarius 8y ago

https://www.amazon.com/Cryptoasset-Inheritance-Planning-Simple-Owners/dp/1947910116 https://www.amazon.com/Cryptoasset-Inheritance-Planning-Simp... Haven’t read it; I just googled “crypto estate planning” (which google had an autocomplete for).

kkarakk 8y ago
8 customer reviews, not even the top 200 when you search within the estate planning section...nice, i'm sure lots of people have read this