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US actually produces the most oil of any country now. I'd like to see someone do the math and see if it would be cheaper to leave the middle east and save money

US actually produces the most oil of any country now. I'd like to see someone do the math and see if it would be cheaper to leave the middle east and save money on wars and just subsidize our own oil production to make up the difference for any price increase consumers might see. Of course that won't happen because war is a industry now What's also amazing to me is seeing this culture defended by the left, when if most muslims were given power in Europe they would strip away most rights for women and homosexuals that the left also fought for

robinduckett 8y ago
> What's also amazing to me is seeing this culture defended by the left, when if most muslims were given power in Europe they would strip away most rights for women and homosexuals that the left also fought for This is absolute horseshit and if you truly believe this then you are sorely mistaken.
mrguyorama 8y ago
>What's also amazing to me is seeing this culture defended by the left You're going to need a citation for that. Projecting such a large claim against such a large heterogeneous blob of people with absolutely zero evidence to back it up should not be acceptable on HN
- LifeLiverTransp 8y ago
  They do that for example, by disolving a claim with intelectual dishonesty, expecting effort of proof for a group that shows - beside cheap words - near zero effort to back away from bad actors and bad principles/traditions. Like if I where to claim that not all facism is racistic, because facism was historically a very heterogenous blob of people with absolutly zero evidence to back up that they all where as racistic as the nazis. Then i would be wrong. To some ideologies, there is no right to repair, because the basic concept subverts human rights and democracy.
- crowdpleaser 8y ago
  Were you watching TV when Trump instituted the 'Muslim Ban'? Every good thinker tripped over themselves to (mis)characterize it as such and defend Islam. Look at the party affiliation of all the pro-Hamas, pro-Palestine, pro-hijab, pro-middle east migration politician in America. Just the other day a Muslim Democratic Congressperson from Minnesota compared Israel's treatment of Muslims to the South's treatment of blacks under slavery. By the way when she was a state representative, she helped defeat legislation that banned female circumcision and to my knowledge she's never condemned the practice. Not every American leftist defends retrograde Muslim culture, but the only people in America who defend retrograde Muslim culture are leftists.
  - rhcom2 8y ago
    That just isn't true. Ilhan Omar voted for it and it died in the state Senate and she specifically condemned the practice. http://checkyourfact.com/2018/11/29/fact-check-ilhan-omar-vote-female-genital-mutilation-felony/ http://checkyourfact.com/2018/11/29/fact-check-ilhan-omar-vo...
    - crowdpleaser 8y ago
      Fair enough, I was misinformed. However, which party was in control of the senate that failed to pass the bill? If you can take my word for it - it was Minnesota's democratic party.
      - ceejayoz 8y ago
        They didn't pass the bill because it was redundant. (Remember, it passed the House 128-4; there's no bipartisan divide on this issue.) https://www.mprnews.org/story/2018/11/26/lawmakers-plan-fresh-push-against-female-genital-mutilation https://www.mprnews.org/story/2018/11/26/lawmakers-plan-fres... > Under current state law, parents who arrange or knowingly allow the procedure on a daughter can be charged with the crime of aiding and abetting the crime of female genital mutilation or with child neglect or endangerment, according to a report by the nonpartisan Minnesota House Research Department, which noted that both of those offenses are felonies. Side note: It appears the MN Senate was controlled by the Republicans in 2017/2018 when the bill was up for a vote, not the Democrats as you assert. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/90th_Minnesota_Legislature https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/90th_Minnesota_Legislature You should ask yourself where you got this flagrantly false information from, and why you were primed to believe it.
- fzeroracer 8y ago
  It's amusing and somewhat annoying to see people attempt to categorize all Muslims as wanting to destroy the rights of women in the US while the rights of women in the US are under very real siege by Christian fundamentalists tearing apart bits and pieces for things like reproductive rights. The left isn't afraid of Muslims in the US because not only are they usually more progressive than their fundamentalist counterparts but also because they're a minority population with very little political power. It's a rather disengenous argument. I see very little fear or animosity pointed towards the groups that are actively in power and trying to tear things down versus the scapegoat being blamed for the actions of another country.
- tossaccount123 8y ago
  Does "Islamophobia" ring a bell? It's a term made up to demean anybody with concerns of how Muslims assimilate with western civilization and implies those concerns are irrational or even some sort of mental disorder https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/30/muslim-survey_n_3186144.html https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/30/muslim-survey_n_31... 75% of muslims say abortion is wrong and 80% reject homosexuality. A large chunk also support Sharia law now here's the huffington post and vox defending against islamophobia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamophobia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamophobia https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/islamophobia-thriving-in-europe-new-report-says_us_58dd909ce4b05eae031e8eb4 https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/islamophobia-thriving-i... https://www.vox.com/2015/12/1/9822452/muslim-islamophobia-trump https://www.vox.com/2015/12/1/9822452/muslim-islamophobia-tr... Seems illogical to me
  - dang 8y ago
    We've banned this account for using HN for ideological battle and ignoring our request to stop. Religious flamewar is particularly unwelcome here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
LifeLiverTransp 8y ago
I sometimes think, there is some deep supressed longing for dominance in the extreme left, if you look at what they choose to follow given a choice. Its always the most brutal dictator (Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot), the most Macho of Men (Che Guevarra etc.) - its like the moment someone speaks the right left words- all thoughts on ideology are forgotten and the most primal of instincts may reign as free as they do, cherished on the extreme right wing.
- protonfish 8y ago
  I like to think both parties are extreme authoritarian, just different flavors - paternal vs. maternal. Dominance and submission are two sides of the same dysfunctional coin.
- dang 8y ago
  Please don't use HN for ideological battle. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
deogeo 8y ago
> if it would be cheaper to leave the middle east and save money on wars Cheaper for the US as a whole perhaps (even probably), but the military-industrial complex would make less money.
dang 8y ago
It looks like you've been using HN primarily for ideological battle. That's against both the rules and spirit of this site, and we ban accounts that do it, so would you please stop doing it? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

robinduckett 8y ago

> What's also amazing to me is seeing this culture defended by the left, when if most muslims were given power in Europe they would strip away most rights for women and homosexuals that the left also fought for This is absolute horseshit and if you truly believe this then you are sorely mistaken.

mrguyorama 8y ago

>What's also amazing to me is seeing this culture defended by the left You're going to need a citation for that. Projecting such a large claim against such a large heterogeneous blob of people with absolutely zero evidence to back it up should not be acceptable on HN

LifeLiverTransp 8y ago
They do that for example, by disolving a claim with intelectual dishonesty, expecting effort of proof for a group that shows - beside cheap words - near zero effort to back away from bad actors and bad principles/traditions. Like if I where to claim that not all facism is racistic, because facism was historically a very heterogenous blob of people with absolutly zero evidence to back up that they all where as racistic as the nazis. Then i would be wrong. To some ideologies, there is no right to repair, because the basic concept subverts human rights and democracy.
crowdpleaser 8y ago
Were you watching TV when Trump instituted the 'Muslim Ban'? Every good thinker tripped over themselves to (mis)characterize it as such and defend Islam. Look at the party affiliation of all the pro-Hamas, pro-Palestine, pro-hijab, pro-middle east migration politician in America. Just the other day a Muslim Democratic Congressperson from Minnesota compared Israel's treatment of Muslims to the South's treatment of blacks under slavery. By the way when she was a state representative, she helped defeat legislation that banned female circumcision and to my knowledge she's never condemned the practice. Not every American leftist defends retrograde Muslim culture, but the only people in America who defend retrograde Muslim culture are leftists.
- rhcom2 8y ago
  That just isn't true. Ilhan Omar voted for it and it died in the state Senate and she specifically condemned the practice. http://checkyourfact.com/2018/11/29/fact-check-ilhan-omar-vote-female-genital-mutilation-felony/ http://checkyourfact.com/2018/11/29/fact-check-ilhan-omar-vo...
  - crowdpleaser 8y ago
    Fair enough, I was misinformed. However, which party was in control of the senate that failed to pass the bill? If you can take my word for it - it was Minnesota's democratic party.
    - ceejayoz 8y ago
      They didn't pass the bill because it was redundant. (Remember, it passed the House 128-4; there's no bipartisan divide on this issue.) https://www.mprnews.org/story/2018/11/26/lawmakers-plan-fresh-push-against-female-genital-mutilation https://www.mprnews.org/story/2018/11/26/lawmakers-plan-fres... > Under current state law, parents who arrange or knowingly allow the procedure on a daughter can be charged with the crime of aiding and abetting the crime of female genital mutilation or with child neglect or endangerment, according to a report by the nonpartisan Minnesota House Research Department, which noted that both of those offenses are felonies. Side note: It appears the MN Senate was controlled by the Republicans in 2017/2018 when the bill was up for a vote, not the Democrats as you assert. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/90th_Minnesota_Legislature https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/90th_Minnesota_Legislature You should ask yourself where you got this flagrantly false information from, and why you were primed to believe it.
fzeroracer 8y ago
It's amusing and somewhat annoying to see people attempt to categorize all Muslims as wanting to destroy the rights of women in the US while the rights of women in the US are under very real siege by Christian fundamentalists tearing apart bits and pieces for things like reproductive rights. The left isn't afraid of Muslims in the US because not only are they usually more progressive than their fundamentalist counterparts but also because they're a minority population with very little political power. It's a rather disengenous argument. I see very little fear or animosity pointed towards the groups that are actively in power and trying to tear things down versus the scapegoat being blamed for the actions of another country.
tossaccount123 8y ago
Does "Islamophobia" ring a bell? It's a term made up to demean anybody with concerns of how Muslims assimilate with western civilization and implies those concerns are irrational or even some sort of mental disorder https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/30/muslim-survey_n_3186144.html https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/30/muslim-survey_n_31... 75% of muslims say abortion is wrong and 80% reject homosexuality. A large chunk also support Sharia law now here's the huffington post and vox defending against islamophobia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamophobia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamophobia https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/islamophobia-thriving-in-europe-new-report-says_us_58dd909ce4b05eae031e8eb4 https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/islamophobia-thriving-i... https://www.vox.com/2015/12/1/9822452/muslim-islamophobia-trump https://www.vox.com/2015/12/1/9822452/muslim-islamophobia-tr... Seems illogical to me
- dang 8y ago
  We've banned this account for using HN for ideological battle and ignoring our request to stop. Religious flamewar is particularly unwelcome here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

LifeLiverTransp 8y ago

I sometimes think, there is some deep supressed longing for dominance in the extreme left, if you look at what they choose to follow given a choice. Its always the most brutal dictator (Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot), the most Macho of Men (Che Guevarra etc.) - its like the moment someone speaks the right left words- all thoughts on ideology are forgotten and the most primal of instincts may reign as free as they do, cherished on the extreme right wing.

protonfish 8y ago
I like to think both parties are extreme authoritarian, just different flavors - paternal vs. maternal. Dominance and submission are two sides of the same dysfunctional coin.
dang 8y ago
Please don't use HN for ideological battle. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

deogeo 8y ago

> if it would be cheaper to leave the middle east and save money on wars Cheaper for the US as a whole perhaps (even probably), but the military-industrial complex would make less money.

dang 8y ago

It looks like you've been using HN primarily for ideological battle. That's against both the rules and spirit of this site, and we ban accounts that do it, so would you please stop doing it? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html