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Was anybody ever in any doubt these Apple positions the phone as explicitly not an open computing platform? It’s actually got more open than its original launc

Was anybody ever in any doubt these Apple positions the phone as explicitly not an open computing platform? It’s actually got more open than its original launch, but it is clearly sold as an appliance.

simion314 8y ago
>Was anybody ever in any doubt these Apple positions the phone as explicitly not an open computing platform? I don't think many people think about it, so it6 is not like people are tricked to think is an open computer but they are not even consider the implication. Does average iOS user know that at any moment Apple can brick his device, can remove stuff from his device, can install whatever they want, do they consider that in future this devices will be just briks without the software/cloud part(at least with consoles you may be able to use games on disks for now)
- sbuk 8y ago
  the funny thing is, IIRC, Google are the ones that have *actuallt8 done this.
  - simion314 8y ago
    Do you think that Apple servers will be up forever? That the app you bought today will be there for you to re-install in 20 years? My point is that incidents show regular people the things that are usually "hidden" in big EULAs, is good to have such big incidents we can link to, like when someone tells ypou that is better to keep your data on Google servers since they have brilliant engineers you can link to incidents like the Google+ leaks to show that even Google can ignore security or make mistakes.
    - sbuk 8y ago
      I don’t disagree, though I would say it’s an absurd point. I’m confident enough that Apple’s servers, hosted between GCP, AWS and Azure AFAIK, will outlast my current iPhone and my next few. Also that apps I bought even 10 years ago that are still of use and supported are available to me now. The EULA that was breached here was an Enterprise agreement between Google and Apple. It will have been poured over by teams of lawyers. An individual at Google had decided, “fuck it, whats the worst that could happen?” and found out. I’ve seen people frequently be accused of being “Apple apologist” on this site. What I’m reading is the exact opposite. Google are responsible for their actions, no-one else. As is constantly pointed out, there is an alternative to iPhone, where choice and “freedom” exist, but it comes at a non-financial cost.
      - simion314 8y ago
        I am happy with the Apple decision to force their EULAs for the reason more people can see now what is inside the EULAs. Not all people change their device every 2 years, there should be no reason why you could not use (or give to someone else to continue using) a device(phone,tablet, TV, watch) until it just falls apart.
        sbuk 8y ago
        So let me get this straight - your take away from this is that Apple is bad because they could remove apps from your device, but Google is OK, even though the have actually removed apps and because reasons. We’re done here.
        simion314 8y ago
        No, I am not on Google camp, Google did not respect the EULA, Apple was right to apply the EULA, so all was legal and fair as per the Apple and Google contract. My point is that big EULAs are bad, not controlling your hardware is bad (no matter if is Apple,MS or Google), this incident makes it clear what rights you have with this kind of EULAs
- mcny 8y ago
  On this topic, the smart speakers and to a larger extent smart displays from Amazon Alexa and Google Assistant (and maybe even the fire TV and Chromecast) are very reliant on connection to the server to deliver anything of value. I don't think people realize that it can just go away at any time. I'm sure the terms and conditions allow a clause which shows the company to shut down these services at any time without facing a requirement to buy back these (now useless) gadgets.
- scarface74 8y ago
  And this is different from Google how?
saagarjha 8y ago
That's debatable. While legitimate access has increased, one can make the argument that today's iPhones are much more locked down than their predecessors, some of which had unpatchable bugs in the early stages of their bootloaders that basically rendered Apple's protections useless.

simion314 8y ago

>Was anybody ever in any doubt these Apple positions the phone as explicitly not an open computing platform? I don't think many people think about it, so it6 is not like people are tricked to think is an open computer but they are not even consider the implication. Does average iOS user know that at any moment Apple can brick his device, can remove stuff from his device, can install whatever they want, do they consider that in future this devices will be just briks without the software/cloud part(at least with consoles you may be able to use games on disks for now)

sbuk 8y ago
the funny thing is, IIRC, Google are the ones that have *actuallt8 done this.
- simion314 8y ago
  Do you think that Apple servers will be up forever? That the app you bought today will be there for you to re-install in 20 years? My point is that incidents show regular people the things that are usually "hidden" in big EULAs, is good to have such big incidents we can link to, like when someone tells ypou that is better to keep your data on Google servers since they have brilliant engineers you can link to incidents like the Google+ leaks to show that even Google can ignore security or make mistakes.
  - sbuk 8y ago
    I don’t disagree, though I would say it’s an absurd point. I’m confident enough that Apple’s servers, hosted between GCP, AWS and Azure AFAIK, will outlast my current iPhone and my next few. Also that apps I bought even 10 years ago that are still of use and supported are available to me now. The EULA that was breached here was an Enterprise agreement between Google and Apple. It will have been poured over by teams of lawyers. An individual at Google had decided, “fuck it, whats the worst that could happen?” and found out. I’ve seen people frequently be accused of being “Apple apologist” on this site. What I’m reading is the exact opposite. Google are responsible for their actions, no-one else. As is constantly pointed out, there is an alternative to iPhone, where choice and “freedom” exist, but it comes at a non-financial cost.
    - simion314 8y ago
      I am happy with the Apple decision to force their EULAs for the reason more people can see now what is inside the EULAs. Not all people change their device every 2 years, there should be no reason why you could not use (or give to someone else to continue using) a device(phone,tablet, TV, watch) until it just falls apart.
      - sbuk 8y ago
        So let me get this straight - your take away from this is that Apple is bad because they could remove apps from your device, but Google is OK, even though the have actually removed apps and because reasons. We’re done here.
        simion314 8y ago
        No, I am not on Google camp, Google did not respect the EULA, Apple was right to apply the EULA, so all was legal and fair as per the Apple and Google contract. My point is that big EULAs are bad, not controlling your hardware is bad (no matter if is Apple,MS or Google), this incident makes it clear what rights you have with this kind of EULAs
mcny 8y ago
On this topic, the smart speakers and to a larger extent smart displays from Amazon Alexa and Google Assistant (and maybe even the fire TV and Chromecast) are very reliant on connection to the server to deliver anything of value. I don't think people realize that it can just go away at any time. I'm sure the terms and conditions allow a clause which shows the company to shut down these services at any time without facing a requirement to buy back these (now useless) gadgets.
scarface74 8y ago
And this is different from Google how?

saagarjha 8y ago

That's debatable. While legitimate access has increased, one can make the argument that today's iPhones are much more locked down than their predecessors, some of which had unpatchable bugs in the early stages of their bootloaders that basically rendered Apple's protections useless.