> ... but that does not make them the same I need to check my undergrad metalogic notes, but I think they are "almost" the same. You might be right though, it'

> ... but that does not make them the same I need to check my undergrad metalogic notes, but I think they are "almost" the same. You might be right though, it's a very nuanced point you're making. IIRC, Godel and Lob used the "|- Prov(...)" (or Bew(...)) predicate to essentially make them the same.