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Not really. It’s a hard pill to swallow for Apple that most iPhone users are active Instagram/Facebook/WhatsApp/Messenger users. If they took those apps down pe

by dkrich 8y ago

Not really. It’s a hard pill to swallow for Apple that most iPhone users are active Instagram/Facebook/WhatsApp/Messenger users. If they took those apps down people would be super pissed. I know I’d be extremely annoyed. It would be an interesting twist of irony if they did take them down and there was a massive backlash against Apple. I have a sneaking suspicion that the media and Twitterati are more up in arms about all this than the users themselves.

Barrin92 8y ago
Reasonable action here would be to threaten to pull the affected apps off the store if Facebook doesn't react within a few weeks. I am very confident that Facebook would not take the amount of bad press this would create. Apple has a lot of leverage here, they don't need to just ban facebook apps outright.
- dkrich 8y ago
  I disagree. It’s a pretty equal symbiotic relationship IMO. I keep reading people saying “NO other developer would ever get away with this!” Yes they would- if they had 2.2 billion active users on their platform. This may shock a lot in the tech community, but for some companies the rules don’t apply. Ask Procter and Gamble why Wal-Mart gets better prices than a local grocery. I truly believe Apple needs Facebook at least as much as Facebook needs Apple.
  - Barrin92 8y ago
    I think you might be underestimating to what degree this behaviour actually violates the sort of standards that Apple sets out for its products. Gaining control over all information on your device, including the content of private messages of teenage users shouldn't fly. Preventing this sort of stuff is one of the reasons people pay a premium for apple products, and Cook has stressed this over the last few years. On top of this you can add the fact that they basically shipped renamed onavo code, which was already banned from the app store, so this is de facto a violation of Apple's rules. It's in the long term interest of Apple to not be soft on this stuff, it's not symbiotic.
    - dkrich 8y ago
      I could argue that Apple is just as responsible for this as Facebook. How can they claim to take privacy seriously if it’s clearly possible for bad actors to get around the rules multiple times! How is Apple any less implicated in this than Facebook was in the CA scandal when a bad actor violated its policies and posed as an academic research project to gain access to user data it then sold to third parties? If you are going to hold Facebook accountable for CA, why does Apple get a pass when it enables third parties access to my data?
      - ardy42 8y ago
        > I could argue that Apple is just as responsible for this as Facebook. And you'd be wrong. > How can they claim to take privacy seriously if it’s clearly possible for bad actors to get around the rules multiple times! That's BS. You might as well say: "how can they claim to take security seriously, if it's clearly possible for bad actors to find exploitable bugs in their products multiple times!" Apple has a tough job, and it won't do it perfectly because no one can. It's bizarre to claim that it's excellent but not perfect performance somehow makes it guilty of the things it's trying to stop.
    - stale2002 8y ago
      > Preventing this sort of stuff is one of the reasons people pay a premium for apple products, and Cook has stressed this over the last few years. The device belongs to the user. It is fully within the user's legal right to install apps on their phone, even if Apple disgrees with those apps.
      - swift532 8y ago
        That is your opinion (and I would also appreciate being able to do anything I want with my iPhone), but it's clearly not how Apple sees it.
        stale2002 8y ago
        No, it is not "my opinion". It is instead how the law works. Apple tried, and failed, to sue people for doing things with the phones that were legally purchased by the individual. If you install something Apple doesn't like, it is your full legal right to do so. The courts proved this.
Tepix 8y ago
You can use Instagram and Facebook without the app. It's a lot easier to limit what data Facebook has access to that way. Block 3rd party cookies, install an adblocker and delete the cookies when you are done with FB/Instagram.

by dkrich 8y ago

Barrin92 8y ago

Reasonable action here would be to threaten to pull the affected apps off the store if Facebook doesn't react within a few weeks. I am very confident that Facebook would not take the amount of bad press this would create. Apple has a lot of leverage here, they don't need to just ban facebook apps outright.

dkrich 8y ago
I disagree. It’s a pretty equal symbiotic relationship IMO. I keep reading people saying “NO other developer would ever get away with this!” Yes they would- if they had 2.2 billion active users on their platform. This may shock a lot in the tech community, but for some companies the rules don’t apply. Ask Procter and Gamble why Wal-Mart gets better prices than a local grocery. I truly believe Apple needs Facebook at least as much as Facebook needs Apple.
- Barrin92 8y ago
  I think you might be underestimating to what degree this behaviour actually violates the sort of standards that Apple sets out for its products. Gaining control over all information on your device, including the content of private messages of teenage users shouldn't fly. Preventing this sort of stuff is one of the reasons people pay a premium for apple products, and Cook has stressed this over the last few years. On top of this you can add the fact that they basically shipped renamed onavo code, which was already banned from the app store, so this is de facto a violation of Apple's rules. It's in the long term interest of Apple to not be soft on this stuff, it's not symbiotic.
  - dkrich 8y ago
    I could argue that Apple is just as responsible for this as Facebook. How can they claim to take privacy seriously if it’s clearly possible for bad actors to get around the rules multiple times! How is Apple any less implicated in this than Facebook was in the CA scandal when a bad actor violated its policies and posed as an academic research project to gain access to user data it then sold to third parties? If you are going to hold Facebook accountable for CA, why does Apple get a pass when it enables third parties access to my data?
    - ardy42 8y ago
      > I could argue that Apple is just as responsible for this as Facebook. And you'd be wrong. > How can they claim to take privacy seriously if it’s clearly possible for bad actors to get around the rules multiple times! That's BS. You might as well say: "how can they claim to take security seriously, if it's clearly possible for bad actors to find exploitable bugs in their products multiple times!" Apple has a tough job, and it won't do it perfectly because no one can. It's bizarre to claim that it's excellent but not perfect performance somehow makes it guilty of the things it's trying to stop.
  - stale2002 8y ago
    > Preventing this sort of stuff is one of the reasons people pay a premium for apple products, and Cook has stressed this over the last few years. The device belongs to the user. It is fully within the user's legal right to install apps on their phone, even if Apple disgrees with those apps.
    - swift532 8y ago
      That is your opinion (and I would also appreciate being able to do anything I want with my iPhone), but it's clearly not how Apple sees it.
      - stale2002 8y ago
        No, it is not "my opinion". It is instead how the law works. Apple tried, and failed, to sue people for doing things with the phones that were legally purchased by the individual. If you install something Apple doesn't like, it is your full legal right to do so. The courts proved this.

Tepix 8y ago

You can use Instagram and Facebook without the app. It's a lot easier to limit what data Facebook has access to that way. Block 3rd party cookies, install an adblocker and delete the cookies when you are done with FB/Instagram.