5 ms·

In the Japanese model, you observe where people are going, and make that more efficient. In the Californian model, you decide in committee where people ought t

In the Japanese model, you observe where people are going, and make that more efficient. In the Californian model, you decide in committee where people ought to go (which is everywhere represented by committee members) and design something too big and expensive to succeed.

Retric 8y ago
The second case can be extremely profitable to insiders who get to see their land or business profit from vast amounts of public spending.
the-pigeon 8y ago
The high speed train in California has always been based on connecting the Bay Area and the Los Angeles. They are both the largest population centers in California by any metric. This is not "decide in committee where people ought to go". The particular station locations is much more complicated but still based on population centers but a whole host of NIMBY action pushed a lot of those into less favorable locations.
- seiferteric 8y ago
  What is the goal though? Why do we need to connect SoCal and NorCal with high-speed rail? It would make much more sense to me to connect towns in the central valley to the bay area considering many people already do this "super commute" already and I have to imagine it is miserable. Imagine being able to get from Stockton to Oakland in an hour or less by train. Seems like you could build high speed lines in every town in the central valley to the Bay, from Sacremento down to Madera or something and it would be a way better value than building a line from North to South.
  - 8ytecoder 8y ago
    Exactly. At the very least it should be between Sacramento and San Francisco. A few people I know do 2 hour commutes living in and around Tracy/Sacramento area because it's the only way they can afford to own a house. But then there's no real jobs there and they have to come to SF for that. There's no solution in sight for the "larger" bay area. (Don't get me wrong. I love Shinkansen. That made my Japan trip so much more pleasant than anywhere else I have been. Not a single plane trip within the country. No need to pre-plan. Just buy a ticket and hop on. In California though, I know very few - they do exist - who regularly commute between LA -> SF. Regularly ~ a few times a month for a few days at a time)
- habosa 8y ago
  But do people regularly go between SF and CA? Are those people not well served by the cheap and frequent flights? It seems like the train should aim to replace a route served (poorly) by daily vehicular traffic.
- squirrelicus 8y ago
  What about all the detours to Fresno and Madera and shudder Modesto of all places?

Retric 8y ago

The second case can be extremely profitable to insiders who get to see their land or business profit from vast amounts of public spending.

the-pigeon 8y ago

The high speed train in California has always been based on connecting the Bay Area and the Los Angeles. They are both the largest population centers in California by any metric. This is not "decide in committee where people ought to go". The particular station locations is much more complicated but still based on population centers but a whole host of NIMBY action pushed a lot of those into less favorable locations.

seiferteric 8y ago
What is the goal though? Why do we need to connect SoCal and NorCal with high-speed rail? It would make much more sense to me to connect towns in the central valley to the bay area considering many people already do this "super commute" already and I have to imagine it is miserable. Imagine being able to get from Stockton to Oakland in an hour or less by train. Seems like you could build high speed lines in every town in the central valley to the Bay, from Sacremento down to Madera or something and it would be a way better value than building a line from North to South.
- 8ytecoder 8y ago
  Exactly. At the very least it should be between Sacramento and San Francisco. A few people I know do 2 hour commutes living in and around Tracy/Sacramento area because it's the only way they can afford to own a house. But then there's no real jobs there and they have to come to SF for that. There's no solution in sight for the "larger" bay area. (Don't get me wrong. I love Shinkansen. That made my Japan trip so much more pleasant than anywhere else I have been. Not a single plane trip within the country. No need to pre-plan. Just buy a ticket and hop on. In California though, I know very few - they do exist - who regularly commute between LA -> SF. Regularly ~ a few times a month for a few days at a time)
habosa 8y ago
But do people regularly go between SF and CA? Are those people not well served by the cheap and frequent flights? It seems like the train should aim to replace a route served (poorly) by daily vehicular traffic.
squirrelicus 8y ago
What about all the detours to Fresno and Madera and shudder Modesto of all places?