5 ms·

With at-will employment and layoffs being what they are, the only thing gauche about this would seem to be the lack of notification to the employer. Having see

With at-will employment and layoffs being what they are, the only thing gauche about this would seem to be the lack of notification to the employer. Having seen several mass "firing-squad" style layoffs where there's a meeting and some go right while others go left, I've always wondered why two-weeks notice is so engrained culturally when an employee decides to leave on their own.

EpicEng 8y ago
>I've always wondered why two-weeks notice is so engrained culturally when an employee decides to leave on their own. I'm torn. On one hand, just not showing up is a pretty crappy thing to do to anyone in any situation. On the other, you're right; a company may be perfectly fine leaving you high and dry without notice. Sometimes people in our position get severance or even a heads up, but often times people don't. It's not fair, but I suppose the reality is that many will want a good recommendation, but no one pegs the boss with a layoff.
- paulie_a 8y ago
  Do people actually call for recommendations? Hell I just use a coworker I worked extensively with. I've been asked to be a recommendation by previous co-workers and rarely get a call. It has declined over the past ten years. References seem to be a dead thing. It's a waste of time. Of course they are going to be positive. I can't imagine someone would list a reference where they say "fuck that person"
  - crankylinuxuser 8y ago
    There's even services that you can pay, that will claim to be the so_and_so's supervisor or colleague or whomever to play the references game. They are indeed worthless. Well, unless you're going through clearance paperwork that requires proof of people for things you say happen. Don't like there. It will come back and bite you; with felonies.
    - paulie_a 8y ago
      That sounds like fraud regardless if it is for security clearance or not.
  - EpicEng 8y ago
    Depends I suppose, I don't have any real data aside from my own experience. I've had some companies give previous employers a call (especially in regulated industries), some don't seem to care. They always ask though.
  - virtuexru 8y ago
    Definitely not a dead thing in my experience. All of my past jobs have reached out to all my provided references (as they confirmed with me after) to get a sense of the type of work I did & how it was to work with me.
  - vkou 8y ago
    I've given two references. One for an intern that worked under me, and the company in question was super-thorough about it. They wanted data-supported statements, wanted to know about his projects, and so on. I felt like it was a useful conversation for that company. One was for my old boss. The company in question pretty much wanted to know one thing: "Was he an asshole."
  - zdragnar 8y ago
    I've been called for about 75% of the references I've given.
  - normal_man 8y ago
    It depends, but for my current job they took references seriously and I was glad to have good ones. Of course they will be positive, it's more about "can this guy scrounge up 3 people to vouch for him." If you can't, that's enough to draw a conclusion from.
- gwbas1c 8y ago
  It's all based on your relationship with your existing co-workers, and the current project(s) that you're on. If, in general, things are going good, I'm just moving on, I'm not going to drop projects that I'm in the middle of. This is especially the case if I like my co-workers and would want to work with them again.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
SamReidHughes 8y ago
It makes a lot of sense if you're doing a job where if you don't show up, they have to fill the gap right away. Not so much for software development, but the norms carry over.
paulddraper 8y ago
Any U.S. employer I've had would always either (1) give at least two weeks notice so the employee can find new employment, or (2) give at least two weeks severance pay. In theory, at-will U.S. employers don't have to give any notice for termination, but in practice, is that actually very common?
- Consultant32452 8y ago
  In my experience this is only true for high skilled or white collar jobs. When I worked at a fast food restaurant there were no such protections, but that's when I needed them the most.
Asooka 8y ago
In civilised areas of the world, labour laws stipulate that either side must give 4 weeks notice. There are exceptions to that (usually you can be fired with zero notice during your first one to two months), but you can't just quit, or just be let go on the spot if you're a normal salaried employee.
jressey 8y ago
I'm not saying I think this is right, but people have so little social capital compared to companies. One mistake by an employee could follow them their whole career. A massive firing by a company will be forgotten about in the news by the end of the day. People will need work and eventually apply.
Nasrudith 8y ago
I think the main reason is pragmatic concern for reputation and not burning bridges.
- Retric 8y ago
  It’s more about loss aversion than any real impact. Burning a few bridges has negligible impact in a healthy labor market.

EpicEng 8y ago

>I've always wondered why two-weeks notice is so engrained culturally when an employee decides to leave on their own. I'm torn. On one hand, just not showing up is a pretty crappy thing to do to anyone in any situation. On the other, you're right; a company may be perfectly fine leaving you high and dry without notice. Sometimes people in our position get severance or even a heads up, but often times people don't. It's not fair, but I suppose the reality is that many will want a good recommendation, but no one pegs the boss with a layoff.

paulie_a 8y ago
Do people actually call for recommendations? Hell I just use a coworker I worked extensively with. I've been asked to be a recommendation by previous co-workers and rarely get a call. It has declined over the past ten years. References seem to be a dead thing. It's a waste of time. Of course they are going to be positive. I can't imagine someone would list a reference where they say "fuck that person"
- crankylinuxuser 8y ago
  There's even services that you can pay, that will claim to be the so_and_so's supervisor or colleague or whomever to play the references game. They are indeed worthless. Well, unless you're going through clearance paperwork that requires proof of people for things you say happen. Don't like there. It will come back and bite you; with felonies.
  - paulie_a 8y ago
    That sounds like fraud regardless if it is for security clearance or not.
- EpicEng 8y ago
  Depends I suppose, I don't have any real data aside from my own experience. I've had some companies give previous employers a call (especially in regulated industries), some don't seem to care. They always ask though.
- virtuexru 8y ago
  Definitely not a dead thing in my experience. All of my past jobs have reached out to all my provided references (as they confirmed with me after) to get a sense of the type of work I did & how it was to work with me.
- vkou 8y ago
  I've given two references. One for an intern that worked under me, and the company in question was super-thorough about it. They wanted data-supported statements, wanted to know about his projects, and so on. I felt like it was a useful conversation for that company. One was for my old boss. The company in question pretty much wanted to know one thing: "Was he an asshole."
- zdragnar 8y ago
  I've been called for about 75% of the references I've given.
- normal_man 8y ago
  It depends, but for my current job they took references seriously and I was glad to have good ones. Of course they will be positive, it's more about "can this guy scrounge up 3 people to vouch for him." If you can't, that's enough to draw a conclusion from.
gwbas1c 8y ago
It's all based on your relationship with your existing co-workers, and the current project(s) that you're on. If, in general, things are going good, I'm just moving on, I'm not going to drop projects that I'm in the middle of. This is especially the case if I like my co-workers and would want to work with them again.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

SamReidHughes 8y ago

It makes a lot of sense if you're doing a job where if you don't show up, they have to fill the gap right away. Not so much for software development, but the norms carry over.

paulddraper 8y ago

Any U.S. employer I've had would always either (1) give at least two weeks notice so the employee can find new employment, or (2) give at least two weeks severance pay. In theory, at-will U.S. employers don't have to give any notice for termination, but in practice, is that actually very common?

Consultant32452 8y ago
In my experience this is only true for high skilled or white collar jobs. When I worked at a fast food restaurant there were no such protections, but that's when I needed them the most.

Asooka 8y ago

In civilised areas of the world, labour laws stipulate that either side must give 4 weeks notice. There are exceptions to that (usually you can be fired with zero notice during your first one to two months), but you can't just quit, or just be let go on the spot if you're a normal salaried employee.

jressey 8y ago

I'm not saying I think this is right, but people have so little social capital compared to companies. One mistake by an employee could follow them their whole career. A massive firing by a company will be forgotten about in the news by the end of the day. People will need work and eventually apply.

Nasrudith 8y ago

I think the main reason is pragmatic concern for reputation and not burning bridges.

Retric 8y ago
It’s more about loss aversion than any real impact. Burning a few bridges has negligible impact in a healthy labor market.