> What I'm saying is, all of "this" must have come from something Fair enough > And that "something" is what people refer to as God Expects it's not, is it?

> What I'm saying is, all of "this" must have come from something Fair enough > And that "something" is what people refer to as God Expects it's not, is it? If people stopped at "the thing that kicked off the universe", we'd be laughing. But they don't. You wouldn't need prayer, or moral guidance, or Pope's or whatever. Utterly pointless, the launch was eons ago. You cannot reasonably get from "the universe was created" to anything close to most monotheistic deities. There have been dualist religions that had a stab but they were generally slaughtered if they got too popular.