6 ms·

I wonder what the EU commission will say to that. They only agreed to the WhatsApp takeover because FB stated that they would not do exactly what Zuck has in mi

I wonder what the EU commission will say to that. They only agreed to the WhatsApp takeover because FB stated that they would not do exactly what Zuck has in mind.

fouronnes3 8y ago
Interesting. Source?
- eeeeeeeeeeeee 8y ago
  "The Commission found that Facebook Messenger and WhatsApp are not close competitors." http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-14-1088_en.htm http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-14-1088_en.htm That release sums it up indirectly -- they had no issue with it because they were all distinct platforms with different features, but if Facebook consolidates them, I think that somewhat implies they are competitors and there is clear duplication of offerings.
grahamel 8y ago
FB have already been fined over that "When Facebook took over the WhatsApp messaging service in 2014, it told the [EU] commission it would not be able to match user accounts on both platforms, but went on to do exactly that." https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/may/18/facebook-fined-eu-whatsapp-european-commission https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/may/18/facebook-fi...
- johnnyfaehell 8y ago
  Doing this after they're already talking about forcing them to sell WhatsApp is a bold move.
  - mechazawa 8y ago
    You can't sell the platform if it's heavily integrated. Whoever buys it will just have to rewrite it from scratch then.
    - tivert 8y ago
      > You can't sell the platform if it's heavily integrated. Whoever buys it will just have to rewrite it from scratch then. Not necessarily. My understanding is WhatsApp basically uses the Signal protocol right now, Signal itself is open source, so I assume an acquirer could just stand up some new Signal infrastructure and get 80%+ of WhatsApp functionality without much redevelopment.
      - stingraycharles 8y ago
        Not if they integrate the messaging infrastructures as described in the article...
        tivert 8y ago
        > Not if they integrate the messaging infrastructures as described in the article... WhatsApp is a phone app. Even if Facebook heavily integrates the messaging infrastructures, the problem an acquirer has is porting the existing users over to a new messaging infrastructure. Signal-based infrastructure is (relatively) turn key, most of the software is already developed, deployed, and tested. After you have that, the main thing you have to do is push a new version of the app out to all the different app stores that uses your new infrastructure. Bam, you're done. I am simplifying certain things (there'd definitely be a somewhat complex transition period where your new app would have to support both infrastructures), but my main point is that this integration is not as big of a barrier to re-separation as it may seem.
        johnnyfaehell 8y ago
        > the problem an acquirer has is porting the existing users over to a new messaging infrastructure. If you're selling it, it would be your job to port it. This wouldn't be the purchaser's job, it would be Facebook's job. It would be like expecting someone to dismantle a bed your selling on eBay. No one in their right mind would agree to dismantle it for you unless you were giving it away.
      - 8y ago
- denzil_correa 8y ago
  I think this is another opportunity to look at it under the GDPR lens.
akerro 8y ago
afair Facebook has been already fined something like 2% of profits they made on tracking/profiling whatsapp users. EU and FB are OK now and it's also OK to lie to governments, because punishment will be smaller than profits.
- dfxm12 8y ago
  because punishment will be smaller than profits This is easy to fix by increasing the punishment, right?
  - akerro 8y ago
    but... but will lobby support this?
NietTim 8y ago
Just another fine and they will look away again. The legal way of greasing some palms.

I wonder what the EU commission will say to that. They only agreed to the WhatsApp takeover because FB stated that they would not do exactly what Zuck has in mind.

fouronnes3 8y ago

Interesting. Source?

eeeeeeeeeeeee 8y ago
"The Commission found that Facebook Messenger and WhatsApp are not close competitors." http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-14-1088_en.htm http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-14-1088_en.htm That release sums it up indirectly -- they had no issue with it because they were all distinct platforms with different features, but if Facebook consolidates them, I think that somewhat implies they are competitors and there is clear duplication of offerings.

grahamel 8y ago

FB have already been fined over that "When Facebook took over the WhatsApp messaging service in 2014, it told the [EU] commission it would not be able to match user accounts on both platforms, but went on to do exactly that." https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/may/18/facebook-fined-eu-whatsapp-european-commission https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/may/18/facebook-fi...

johnnyfaehell 8y ago
Doing this after they're already talking about forcing them to sell WhatsApp is a bold move.
- mechazawa 8y ago
  You can't sell the platform if it's heavily integrated. Whoever buys it will just have to rewrite it from scratch then.
  - tivert 8y ago
    > You can't sell the platform if it's heavily integrated. Whoever buys it will just have to rewrite it from scratch then. Not necessarily. My understanding is WhatsApp basically uses the Signal protocol right now, Signal itself is open source, so I assume an acquirer could just stand up some new Signal infrastructure and get 80%+ of WhatsApp functionality without much redevelopment.
    - stingraycharles 8y ago
      Not if they integrate the messaging infrastructures as described in the article...
      - tivert 8y ago
        > Not if they integrate the messaging infrastructures as described in the article... WhatsApp is a phone app. Even if Facebook heavily integrates the messaging infrastructures, the problem an acquirer has is porting the existing users over to a new messaging infrastructure. Signal-based infrastructure is (relatively) turn key, most of the software is already developed, deployed, and tested. After you have that, the main thing you have to do is push a new version of the app out to all the different app stores that uses your new infrastructure. Bam, you're done. I am simplifying certain things (there'd definitely be a somewhat complex transition period where your new app would have to support both infrastructures), but my main point is that this integration is not as big of a barrier to re-separation as it may seem.
        johnnyfaehell 8y ago
        > the problem an acquirer has is porting the existing users over to a new messaging infrastructure. If you're selling it, it would be your job to port it. This wouldn't be the purchaser's job, it would be Facebook's job. It would be like expecting someone to dismantle a bed your selling on eBay. No one in their right mind would agree to dismantle it for you unless you were giving it away.
    - 8y ago
denzil_correa 8y ago
I think this is another opportunity to look at it under the GDPR lens.

akerro 8y ago

afair Facebook has been already fined something like 2% of profits they made on tracking/profiling whatsapp users. EU and FB are OK now and it's also OK to lie to governments, because punishment will be smaller than profits.

dfxm12 8y ago
because punishment will be smaller than profits This is easy to fix by increasing the punishment, right?
- akerro 8y ago
  but... but will lobby support this?

NietTim 8y ago

Just another fine and they will look away again. The legal way of greasing some palms.