4 ms·

> And my country (Germany) was not even involved in the slave trade, or much of colonization. Yes, if you look down far enough in history, you will find violenc

> And my country (Germany) was not even involved in the slave trade, or much of colonization. Yes, if you look down far enough in history, you will find violence and all sorts of ugly things. Your nation quite literally carried out a genocidal project against non-white people so at this point I'm not even sure what you're arguing.

adlkjnndnnd 8y ago
It's all besides the point. As I said, you will find violence, slavery and murder in every person's ancestors history, if you go back far enough. But also, I don't feel guilty for the deeds of my nation, as they happened before my birth. I feel we have a duty to learn from history to prevent bad things from happening. That's it. If you really want to go down that route - you are aware that the USA was taken away from native Americans, who died by the millions?
- billy_beef 8y ago
  If you don't think your nation had a moral duty to apologize for the genocide of millions of Jews, black ppl, disabled ppl and queer people, then I don't think we are going to find common ground. The contingent nature of history seems to largely escape you. > If you really want to go down that route - you are aware that the USA was taken away from native Americans, who died by the millions? Of course and I believe those people are owed reparations both for their historically poor treatment and for the continuing violence they face (see standing rock)
  - adlkjnndnnd 8y ago
    No I don't think we are going to find common ground. As I said, I wasn't around in WWII. The victors of WWII decided on appropriate punishments for the losers, although obviously nothing can bring the dead back to live. So the nation "Germany" is paying what the winners of the war decided. Apart from that, who is "the nation" who is supposed to apologize, and in what way? Are Germans who hid Jews in their attics also to apologize? What about the queer Germans who were imprisoned in the concentration camps, and then returned to a free life in post war Germany? You don't really know anything about the individual Germans, so who are you to dish out universal blame? What about Nazis who emigrated to the US - does that mean the US should also apologize for the genocide of millions of Jews? Yes sometimes crimes of nations can also be disentangled, and things stolen can be returned. But it is also not a card blanche for arbitrary demands, forever. There was in fact also a history before WWII, it was not just a bunch of people turning evil out of the blue. When do you stop - with Adam and Eve? I feel a responsibility to all people, and Germans maybe are raised more sensitive to some issues than others. But that's about it. Maybe if I was sitting on a huge pile of nazi gold, I'd think different. But I am not. So maybe address your blame to the people who actually got rich. "I believe those people are owed reparations" But how much? Are you planning to leave the US, to give them back their land? Somehow I don't think so? How much would be enough, to acquit you of your guilt?
    - dang 8y ago
      We've banned this account. This is not a site for political or ideological battle. Please see https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future.

adlkjnndnnd 8y ago

It's all besides the point. As I said, you will find violence, slavery and murder in every person's ancestors history, if you go back far enough. But also, I don't feel guilty for the deeds of my nation, as they happened before my birth. I feel we have a duty to learn from history to prevent bad things from happening. That's it. If you really want to go down that route - you are aware that the USA was taken away from native Americans, who died by the millions?

billy_beef 8y ago
If you don't think your nation had a moral duty to apologize for the genocide of millions of Jews, black ppl, disabled ppl and queer people, then I don't think we are going to find common ground. The contingent nature of history seems to largely escape you. > If you really want to go down that route - you are aware that the USA was taken away from native Americans, who died by the millions? Of course and I believe those people are owed reparations both for their historically poor treatment and for the continuing violence they face (see standing rock)
- adlkjnndnnd 8y ago
  No I don't think we are going to find common ground. As I said, I wasn't around in WWII. The victors of WWII decided on appropriate punishments for the losers, although obviously nothing can bring the dead back to live. So the nation "Germany" is paying what the winners of the war decided. Apart from that, who is "the nation" who is supposed to apologize, and in what way? Are Germans who hid Jews in their attics also to apologize? What about the queer Germans who were imprisoned in the concentration camps, and then returned to a free life in post war Germany? You don't really know anything about the individual Germans, so who are you to dish out universal blame? What about Nazis who emigrated to the US - does that mean the US should also apologize for the genocide of millions of Jews? Yes sometimes crimes of nations can also be disentangled, and things stolen can be returned. But it is also not a card blanche for arbitrary demands, forever. There was in fact also a history before WWII, it was not just a bunch of people turning evil out of the blue. When do you stop - with Adam and Eve? I feel a responsibility to all people, and Germans maybe are raised more sensitive to some issues than others. But that's about it. Maybe if I was sitting on a huge pile of nazi gold, I'd think different. But I am not. So maybe address your blame to the people who actually got rich. "I believe those people are owed reparations" But how much? Are you planning to leave the US, to give them back their land? Somehow I don't think so? How much would be enough, to acquit you of your guilt?
  - dang 8y ago
    We've banned this account. This is not a site for political or ideological battle. Please see https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future.