4 ms·

Is this actually a good thing? In Germany (esp Berlin) homeless people do this a lot, but I've seen them basically empty a whole trash container on the street t

Is this actually a good thing? In Germany (esp Berlin) homeless people do this a lot, but I've seen them basically empty a whole trash container on the street to get a few bottles. While it's great there is a revenue source for the homeless; I can't help thinking that it's not a great way to do it. Must cost a fortune to clean up the trash after people have been through them, way more than the few (euro)cents you get back...

blacksmith_tb 8y ago
The simple solution is to design recycling carts with some kind of for-deposit-item hopper. Here in Portland I just set mine next to the can, since there's no chance they'll go unclaimed.
ghostly_s 8y ago
When I was in Berlin recently it seemed ubiquitous to set redeemable bottles aside for the homeless to collect, or just hand them to homeless people directly. Seemed like only the tourists were throwing them in the trash. Not to say dumping bins doesn't happen but certaintly didn't seem like a widespread problem -- and how exactly does it cost "a fortune" to clean up a pile of trash in the street? Street cleaners are already on payroll.
- SOLAR_FIELDS 8y ago
  In Sweden it works the same. When you are walking down the street and finish your drink, it's common courtesy to not throw it in the trash can, but instead just leave it on the ground right next to the trash can for someone to collect. They've also basically completely mitigated the fraud aspect of this by having all machines in all grocery stores scan the UPC on the bottle to determine whether it is manufactured in Sweden. The deposit is pretty significant there too, 1 SEK, which is equivalent to about 10 cents right now.
makeiteasy 8y ago
In Los Angeles, most people put them into a separate bag in their recycling bins. Then the homeless and scavengers come by and just take a single bag out of the bin without causing too much other trouble. They will occasionally dump a bin to get something at the bottom, but it's pretty rare in my experience.
vidarh 8y ago
If there is such a problem with homeless people that desperate, then perhaps it is a sign one should do something about helping the homeless. I grew up in Norway, and while Norway certainly isn't free of homeless people, I never saw this despite a widespread bottle return system (in fact, the Norwegian company Tomra has a majority of the world "reverse vending machine" market, primarily focused on bottle returns). Norway have had a return rate in the 95%+ range for years in large part because a variety of groups of people see empty bottles as an income source. I think this to a large extent have also culturally solved the problem: while some people certainly throw their bottles in the bin, there's little reason not to instead put your bottle down next to it, because you know it will get picked up.
- bluGill 8y ago
  You make it sound easy. Homeless is a hard problem: most of those people are mentally ill, and do not trust the helpers. If they can live on their own without help it can well be argued they are happier that way then in a home will professional help. This is a very complex subject that I've only scratched the surface of.
  - vidarh 8y ago
    Yes, but there is a significant difference between people "just" being homeless, and people being homeless and so desperate that they cause other problems. One can alleviate their problems in many ways even if one does not manage to remove homelessness.
- flurdy 8y ago
  The 95% return rate has been kept up in more recent times even if the 1-2kr deposit has become less incentive due to price increases as they added a lottery option to all the machines. [1] So instead of collecting your deposit, you can now click a button to see if you win a price (up to 1 million NOK), and if you lose you donate it to the Red Cross. I remember as a kid in the 80s collecting bottles at events etc, back when a bottle of Coke was 6kr so the 1 kr deposit made a difference. I feel happy these days to press the donate button though when I am in the country. [1] https://pantelotteriet.no/english/ https://pantelotteriet.no/english/
deleted 8y ago
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blacksmith_tb 8y ago

The simple solution is to design recycling carts with some kind of for-deposit-item hopper. Here in Portland I just set mine next to the can, since there's no chance they'll go unclaimed.

ghostly_s 8y ago

When I was in Berlin recently it seemed ubiquitous to set redeemable bottles aside for the homeless to collect, or just hand them to homeless people directly. Seemed like only the tourists were throwing them in the trash. Not to say dumping bins doesn't happen but certaintly didn't seem like a widespread problem -- and how exactly does it cost "a fortune" to clean up a pile of trash in the street? Street cleaners are already on payroll.

SOLAR_FIELDS 8y ago
In Sweden it works the same. When you are walking down the street and finish your drink, it's common courtesy to not throw it in the trash can, but instead just leave it on the ground right next to the trash can for someone to collect. They've also basically completely mitigated the fraud aspect of this by having all machines in all grocery stores scan the UPC on the bottle to determine whether it is manufactured in Sweden. The deposit is pretty significant there too, 1 SEK, which is equivalent to about 10 cents right now.

makeiteasy 8y ago

In Los Angeles, most people put them into a separate bag in their recycling bins. Then the homeless and scavengers come by and just take a single bag out of the bin without causing too much other trouble. They will occasionally dump a bin to get something at the bottom, but it's pretty rare in my experience.

vidarh 8y ago

If there is such a problem with homeless people that desperate, then perhaps it is a sign one should do something about helping the homeless. I grew up in Norway, and while Norway certainly isn't free of homeless people, I never saw this despite a widespread bottle return system (in fact, the Norwegian company Tomra has a majority of the world "reverse vending machine" market, primarily focused on bottle returns). Norway have had a return rate in the 95%+ range for years in large part because a variety of groups of people see empty bottles as an income source. I think this to a large extent have also culturally solved the problem: while some people certainly throw their bottles in the bin, there's little reason not to instead put your bottle down next to it, because you know it will get picked up.

bluGill 8y ago
You make it sound easy. Homeless is a hard problem: most of those people are mentally ill, and do not trust the helpers. If they can live on their own without help it can well be argued they are happier that way then in a home will professional help. This is a very complex subject that I've only scratched the surface of.
- vidarh 8y ago
  Yes, but there is a significant difference between people "just" being homeless, and people being homeless and so desperate that they cause other problems. One can alleviate their problems in many ways even if one does not manage to remove homelessness.
flurdy 8y ago
The 95% return rate has been kept up in more recent times even if the 1-2kr deposit has become less incentive due to price increases as they added a lottery option to all the machines. [1] So instead of collecting your deposit, you can now click a button to see if you win a price (up to 1 million NOK), and if you lose you donate it to the Red Cross. I remember as a kid in the 80s collecting bottles at events etc, back when a bottle of Coke was 6kr so the 1 kr deposit made a difference. I feel happy these days to press the donate button though when I am in the country. [1] https://pantelotteriet.no/english/ https://pantelotteriet.no/english/

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]